21 replies to this topic

[Clan Elder 'Keen]

Any word on a fix for the display bug for quantity of Shipyard Slips?

[RTGPete]

Clan Elder'Keen, on Nov 4 2007, 07:56 PM, said:

Any word on a fix for the display bug for quantity of Shipyard Slips?

Fixing it causes other issues in the report generator. I've considered adding a new report with just shipyard slips, but that would burn an entire page even if you only have a couple of pop groups with slips. I'll probably settle on adding a slip display at the bottom of the end turn adjustments section, in simple text, like the fleet listings.

[Paradigm]

Any sort of shipyard slip report would be a good thing.

If you could add an option to exclude alien ships sightings based on a set political agreement level or better, that would save most of us many many pages. Adding a page for a shipyard slip report would then be small potatoes.

While thinking about it, keep in mind that the working shipyards report has been slightly broken since the start of the game.

[Kurassier]

Paradigm, on Nov 5 2007, 12:40 PM, said:

Any sort of shipyard slip report would be a good thing.

If you could add an option to exclude alien ships sightings based on a set political agreement level or better, that would save most of us many many pages. Adding a page for a shipyard slip report would then be small potatoes.

While thinking about it, keep in mind that the working shipyards report has been slightly broken since the start of the game.

True. I built a bunch of skim ships awhile back, and instead of being listed as 'tankers' in the shipyard report. They would be listed as Battleship, Cruiser, Express Yacht, etc.

[cestvel]

Why not simply list the slips as installations in the installation report like shipyards?

[Clan Elder 'Keen]

RTGPete, on Nov 4 2007, 11:10 PM, said:

Clan Elder'Keen, on Nov 4 2007, 07:56 PM, said:

Any word on a fix for the display bug for quantity of Shipyard Slips?

Fixing it causes other issues in the report generator. I've considered adding a new report with just shipyard slips, but that would burn an entire page even if you only have a couple of pop groups with slips. I'll probably settle on adding a slip display at the bottom of the end turn adjustments section, in simple text, like the fleet listings.

Whatever format you think is best.

[Octus Imperium]

Kurassier, on Nov 5 2007, 02:55 PM, said:

Paradigm, on Nov 5 2007, 12:40 PM, said:

Any sort of shipyard slip report would be a good thing.

If you could add an option to exclude alien ships sightings based on a set political agreement level or better, that would save most of us many many pages. Adding a page for a shipyard slip report would then be small potatoes.

While thinking about it, keep in mind that the working shipyards report has been slightly broken since the start of the game.

True. I built a bunch of skim ships awhile back, and instead of being listed as 'tankers' in the shipyard report. They would be listed as Battleship, Cruiser, Express Yacht, etc.

All my skimmers are express yachts. I find the skimming operations modestly improved if they have a ready supply of diversions. It helps if the skimming operations are relatively close to a StarBar. Of course, too close to a StarBar and the operations become very erratic and inefficient.

Seriously, the addition of one more page to have accurate slip documentation would be a real help. I doubt most players print out every page, just critical ones. Of course, I could be wrong about toner use....

Octus

[hobknob]

I try and limit my printing to < 500 pages all told so convoy routes are not generally printed.

I know some do not print anything, but I have not managed to find a non paper method that works for me.

[cestvel]

I do my turns paperless. What do you review on paper?

[Soerenjev]

cestvel, on Nov 7 2007, 10:47 AM, said:

I do my turns paperless. What do you review on paper?

If you ride subway or bus a lot, turns on paper come in handy.

[TErnest]

cestvel, on Nov 7 2007, 02:47 AM, said:

I do my turns paperless. What do you review on paper?

I'm with Hobknob here, Cestvel. It is not so much that I am unable to look at a computer screen. But having a paper printout does give certain advantages, including but not limited to:

Being able to look at 4 or more widely separated pages of my printout simultaneously, to cross-reference their data.
Being able to write notes for my upcoming orders on a piece of paper that readily gives a frame of reference, so that I can double check my work easily. (And besides, my wife hates it when I write on the monitor.)
Being able to work on my turn while waiting in the car to pickup my son from his "Money, The Gathering" games.
Not having to worry about argueing with my wife and two sons about who gets the computer this hour when I want to work on my turns.

I do think that eventually we will become a paperless society. For my own part, there are still things that my available technology cannot give me. Until it does, I will continue to be forced to kill trees.

TErnest

[Octus Imperium]

TErnest, on Nov 7 2007, 12:34 PM, said:

cestvel, on Nov 7 2007, 02:47 AM, said:

I do my turns paperless. What do you review on paper?

I'm with Hobknob here, Cestvel. It is not so much that I am unable to look at a computer screen. But having a paper printout does give certain advantages, including but not limited to:

Being able to look at 4 or more widely separated pages of my printout simultaneously, to cross-reference their data.
Being able to write notes for my upcoming orders on a piece of paper that readily gives a frame of reference, so that I can double check my work easily. (And besides, my wife hates it when I write on the monitor.)
Being able to work on my turn while waiting in the car to pickup my son from his "Money, The Gathering" games.
Not having to worry about argueing with my wife and two sons about who gets the computer this hour when I want to work on my turns.

I do think that eventually we will become a paperless society. For my own part, there are still things that my available technology cannot give me. Until it does, I will continue to be forced to kill trees.

TErnest

I also use paper for stepping through my orders and cross checking various outputs. If I had 3 or 4 large flat screens that my cpu could provide output to, then I would probably avoid paper. But I am not a day trader (or a professional trader for that matter who can use the office systems in off hours) and suspect the power consumed to light up multiple screens may be net more inefficient than paper usage. For those who have younger eyes and better memories, then paperless is probably the way to go. I also recycle the back side of printouts for turn support documents (such as ship designs and warp point summaries). And only print convoy and standing order sheets when the previous set are hopelessly out of date.

I, for one, find the act of holding a book in my hands when I read for work or pleasure somehow much more fulfilling than reading it from a screen. Yes, a throw back in the eyes of the Gen Y'ers. But don't you just love holding a mature book in your hand? Along with a mature vintage, brew or distilled beverage in the other. I would rather not live in a completely paperless society.

Octus

Soerenjev, on Nov 7 2007, 10:51 AM, said:

cestvel, on Nov 7 2007, 10:47 AM, said:

I do my turns paperless. What do you review on paper?

If you ride subway or bus a lot, turns on paper come in handy.

Well, I bet the snoops find your printouts very interesting, indeed! Ever worry about other players looking over your shoulder on the bus?

Octus

[Soerenjev]

Octus Imperium, on Nov 8 2007, 12:19 AM, said:

TErnest, on Nov 7 2007, 12:34 PM, said:

cestvel, on Nov 7 2007, 02:47 AM, said:

I do my turns paperless. What do you review on paper?

I'm with Hobknob here, Cestvel. It is not so much that I am unable to look at a computer screen. But having a paper printout does give certain advantages, including but not limited to:

Being able to look at 4 or more widely separated pages of my printout simultaneously, to cross-reference their data.
Being able to write notes for my upcoming orders on a piece of paper that readily gives a frame of reference, so that I can double check my work easily. (And besides, my wife hates it when I write on the monitor.)
Being able to work on my turn while waiting in the car to pickup my son from his "Money, The Gathering" games.
Not having to worry about argueing with my wife and two sons about who gets the computer this hour when I want to work on my turns.

I do think that eventually we will become a paperless society. For my own part, there are still things that my available technology cannot give me. Until it does, I will continue to be forced to kill trees.

TErnest

I also use paper for stepping through my orders and cross checking various outputs. If I had 3 or 4 large flat screens that my cpu could provide output to, then I would probably avoid paper. But I am not a day trader (or a professional trader for that matter who can use the office systems in off hours) and suspect the power consumed to light up multiple screens may be net more inefficient than paper usage. For those who have younger eyes and better memories, then paperless is probably the way to go. I also recycle the back side of printouts for turn support documents (such as ship designs and warp point summaries). And only print convoy and standing order sheets when the previous set are hopelessly out of date.

I, for one, find the act of holding a book in my hands when I read for work or pleasure somehow much more fulfilling than reading it from a screen. Yes, a throw back in the eyes of the Gen Y'ers. But don't you just love holding a mature book in your hand? Along with a mature vintage, brew or distilled beverage in the other. I would rather not live in a completely paperless society.

Octus

Soerenjev, on Nov 7 2007, 10:51 AM, said:

cestvel, on Nov 7 2007, 10:47 AM, said:

I do my turns paperless. What do you review on paper?

If you ride subway or bus a lot, turns on paper come in handy.

Well, I bet the snoops find your printouts very interesting, indeed! Ever worry about other players looking over your shoulder on the bus?

Octus

I am quite sure I know all supernova players in my city personally.

[Paradigm]

TErnest, on Nov 7 2007, 08:34 PM, said:

Being able to write notes for my upcoming orders on a piece of paper that readily gives a frame of reference, so that I can double check my work easily. (And besides, my wife hates it when I write on the monitor.)

TErnest

She might be more understanding if you used a water soluble pen.

I never print my turn results. They run hundreds of pages but I don't even print subsets. Using 3 monitors works nicely, but one has to have 3 monitors and they are far from portable. To each his own in that regard.

But, I still would like to see the shipyard slip report problem fixed even if it is a simple list somewhere in the turn results. And I would also be happy to have an option to suppress allied fleet sightings. With modern ships having AP ratings in the hundreds, sharing a gas giant skim point with an ally results in many pages of useless sighting reports. Even though I don't print them out, it is more to wade through in my turn results, bloats the PDF files, and is just generally a nuisance. At this rate it is not inconceivable that the results files for some empires will start to exceed the 10MB email size limit of most ISP's, especially when you realize the actual email size will be bigger than the PDF attachment once they are 7-bit (usually base 64) encoded for emailing.

[hobknob]

I generally print out the relevant order results section, about 10-20 pages depending on number of orders submitted and naval battles, then I skip to the production phase and usually print out everything from the start of production through the end of pop group stockpiles. If there happens to be pages and pages of fleet sightings in there I will generally try and skip them as well. The last bit I print is the Research Center allocation through the end of the printout including all the convoy route stuff.

My turn process usually involves going through each position and making any adjustments to research, production and builds, annotating each item on the appropriate page. The production report is used to compare to the build orders so adjustments can be made.

Movement is much of the same. I make notes in each fleet for the next turns movements, priority of movements etc. I generally go through each fleet and look to see if there is something that the fleet should be doing. Somewhere on the printout I also list any new ship designs that need to be built.

The hardest part of the process is paring down the wish list of orders to those that actually get processed. For my bigger positions I can come up with 300-400 orders easily. Even with my smaller positions I can generally come up with 120 orders at a minimum.

It is about this time that my gaming budget manager, AKA spouse, has a say in turn processing. She is generally pretty good about things, but a few fewer orders is much better than no orders. That is the dilemma of a cost per order system.

I have tried on several occasions, especially while being deployed/traveling, to go paperless with minimal success. I just haven't gotten a handle on how folks can do the necessary planning without paper. I would love to hear how others mange to do it successfully.