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richardjohns
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Agree with Schmutti. Better to have all positions filled. Question for now is, why is it so difficult to fill positions for new games?

 

Shrinking player base?

Poor customer service?

Lack of 'outreach'/promoting/advertising?

 

People playing that keep exploiting the known bugs in Victory, making it less interesting for others to keep playing?

 

The only bug that I know of is the fighter cover/intercept bug. I've never experienced it, but I've seen it mentioned on here. Are there others?

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Agree with Schmutti. Better to have all positions filled. Question for now is, why is it so difficult to fill positions for new games?

 

Shrinking player base?

Poor customer service?

Lack of 'outreach'/promoting/advertising?

I think the shrinking player base is the reason.

 

Can't be poor customer service because the customer service is great. In all the years I've played Victory I've had ZERO problems. Russ can be a little slow to update the final game standings, but other than that, he's always been very responsive to any questions or concerns I've ever had.

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Well, In my most humble opinion, some of these tactic’s that some people are claiming to “Bugs”, ARE NOT “BUGS”!!

Like with this FC thing. It sounds more like some people figured out a way to gain a defensive advantage and maximize the effect according to how the rules are written. This sounds more like “Master Level” game play to me, “NOT A BUG”!!

Personally, I think TA’s should be able to do FC for each other. That said, Russ can’t change these thing without re-writing the whole game code. The game is to old for patch work now. So all this Bitching, Whining and Complaining about so called Bugs, when there is nothing that can be done about it anyway, is pointless and useless

You ARE NOT helping the low player issue any either. Think about it, a new player comes along and see’s people bitching about “Bug” this and “HACK” that. Why would that player want to stick around.

 

Chapter D

The Air Force, 4.23 Range and Route to Target

The shortest route to the target may not always be the most desirable (perhaps your enemy has concentrated his defenses along that route)

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I think victory is a great game and I played it long ago in game 9. I am just trying to figure out all the rules before starting. Some are not always evident. One example is the RPD order not costing anything if you fail. I just emailed them and they said

 

To

Today at 6:53 PM

Hi Richard,

I have no plans on updating the code for that order so yep, should be no cost unless it is successful.

Best wishes!

Russ

Russ Norris

Rolling Thunder Games – Victory!

victory@rollingthunder.com

RTGRuss@hotmail.com [alternate]

Hide original message

From: Richard Johns [mailto:richardjohnsii@yahoo.com]
Sent: Wednesday, July 05, 2017 9:04 PM
To: Victory!
Subject: Question about RPD before game 101 begins

Hey Pete and Russ,

I wanted to know is the RPD order still going to be free if the order fails? Just planning out my first turn.

Richard Johns

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@Ed / Lord Patton:

I am quite surprised. How you can come to the conclusion that the FC-bug is NOT a bug??

 

Fighter Cover
A force with "Fighter Cover" orders will patrol a series of provinces, sea zones or a combination thereof and provide fighter protection to YOUR naval and/or army forces in those provinces/sea zones should they come under attack. If any of YOUR naval and/or army forces are attacked in a province or sea zone being patrolled by a force with "Fighter Cover" orders, that patrolling air force will react and engage the attacking enemy air force in air combat.

 

There is NO "your TA" or something like that - so the wording how it was meant is very clear and does not leave any room for an other interpretation.

This also has been confirmed by Russ on several occasions - and i also think that players accepted that.

 

I also think that anything else than that would not make sense (i am aware that balance can always be a topic for deep discussions).

It would mean that you maybe have to cope with 2 x 50 fighters before getting to the target, while only being allowed to have 1 x 25 on escort.

 

Of course, in "real life" you should be able to protect your allieds - but this is not real life, it's a simplified game where balancing should be done in a best possible way.

 

And as we all know the bug and as Russ is forced to do something every time the bug is being triggered (by intention or by accident), let's simply not create situation where the bug is being triggered.

:cheers:

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And i agree with Kevin...

 

Russ is doing a good service in daily business.

His responsivness when sending him questions, etc. always has been great - at least in my case.

 

I still hope that he comes along with the missing game-statistics :woohoo:

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We could fix the two bugs mentioned RPD and FC by simply updating the rules providing the FC of a TA's base occurs consistently (I have never seen this occur) . I think the rules could also use a update on the retreat and merging of forces.

 

In regards to bugs I have seen 2 that are not consistent. The first is when a naval battle occurs and a ship goes above a 100%. If it occurs in a battle with another player the other player can actually end up with negative ship kills since one of the survivors is above 100%. I had heard about it and experienced it in a mine engagement. One of my surviving minesweepers went to 32000%. The following turn it dropped back to 100% so perhaps its just a end of turn issue that is automatically adjusted at the start of the next turn.

 

The other inconsistency I have seen is when moving population. I have seen a RP order actually add money to your treasury. I had a negative treasury when it occurred and was moving a large block of population to one of the Greek Isles and I ended my turn with a lower negative treasury. The unexpected money addition matched the expected cost of the RP order.

 

I suspect neither of these occurs more than 1% of the time so they really don't have much of a impact on game play.

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We could fix the two bugs mentioned RPD and FC by simply updating the rules providing the FC of a TA's base occurs consistently (I have never seen this occur) . I think the rules could also use a update on the retreat and merging of forces.

 

In regards to bugs I have seen 2 that are not consistent. The first is when a naval battle occurs and a ship goes above a 100%. If it occurs in a battle with another player the other player can actually end up with negative ship kills since one of the survivors is above 100%. I had heard about it and experienced it in a mine engagement. One of my surviving minesweepers went to 32000%. The following turn it dropped back to 100% so perhaps its just a end of turn issue that is automatically adjusted at the start of the next turn.

 

The other inconsistency I have seen is when moving population. I have seen a RP order actually add money to your treasury. I had a negative treasury when it occurred and was moving a large block of population to one of the Greek Isles and I ended my turn with a lower negative treasury. The unexpected money addition matched the expected cost of the RP order.

 

I suspect neither of these occurs more than 1% of the time so they really don't have much of a impact on game play.

 

RP sounds like a fun one. Just start RP-ing what you want when you're in the red. Cool... :-)

 

Vic wasn't made to have bombers with escorts flying through 100 fighters. As Peter mentioned: It's a game with certain rules to create a balance of some sort.

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I don't think the RPD is a bug, it was written that way. I have always known it was free if you got no effect. The FC thing is a known bug. The issue, as stated above, isn't that you shouldn't be able to defend a TA's territory, but that the game becomes unbalanced when you can only escort with 25 fighters. The bugs in my opinion are really a non issue, they are so rarely used. There are certain things I consider "gamey" that are more of a concern, but overall, Victory! is a great game, and I take issue with anybody who says you have to take advantage of the rules to win.

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I agree with lordpatton. falco has relentlessly pounded our alliance in game 98 because he doesn't like our tactics. I have played uninterrupted since 95 and game 98 was the first time ive seen this issue with the fc. my ally asked me to cede him the province where I had an airbase with fc and he would put fc in the province. i told him the way the rules were written the computer wouldn't let him intercept if i had fc up which i did. to my surprise it worked. the alliance we were fighting contacted and told russ and he asked us to take it down and we immediately did. well you woulda thought it was the end of the world. another of his issues with my alliance is he doesn't want anyone "blinding". I'm sorry but everyone in vic does that it happened to me on turn 5 in game 100. if i run my turn the day before your turn is due and you didn't get defensive battles involving me then you have the option to hold your turn until one of your allies run...

i personally don't agree with the tactic of dropping an air regiment in the retreat location of an army...no way an air REGIMENT (40 arm) is going to kill 18 div trying to retreat somewhere. i think the regiment should be eliminated from vic altogether. but just because i don't agree with a tactic i don't constantly go on the forum and berate someone or an alliance for it as it is allowed under the rules.

berating people on the forum is just driving people away..

i do think later in the game bombers have too much power. an alliance of five can pretty much bomb out whole armies and airbases later in the game. i would not be opposed to allowing the double fc in vic games starting somewhere in the turn 45-50 range. i think it would help to balance the game a little more, protect smaller forces and airbases, as well as give more value to the fighters.

the vic community has dwindled to a shadow of what it used to be.... i think there are a lot of factors involved...i think a lot of the players that used to play as lone wolfs have been chased off by the big groups that form before the game even starts leaving the solo guys no chance...you cant get in the game anymore and look for allies, most groups are formed before the first turn..

there is no new blood coming into the game...this generation is in love with their cell phone games, xbox's, and playstations...it now takes 10-12 months to get a game going and it would probably be worse if we all didn't play in multiple games..

 

i play vic with all its flaws because i genuinely love the game..it has helped me through some tough times in life...it has allowed me to make life long friends i wouldn't have otherwise...that being said i am going to take a break from victory as the timing is good with the two games i am in and i need a break from all the drama game 98 has brought...i ll be back in time...

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I think, in the beginning of victory, an AIR-factory was even producing 20 AIR per turn - that was really dis-balanced :python:

 

I think our gamers-group is small enough and won't grow anymore... and i really don't think that somebody is really using clear bugs for an advantage.

I heard from this morale-bombing-things, but i was never the target of one and i think that also has stopped.

 

The blinding tactics is used in this game and it's not a crime. Nevertheless, i don't like it.

It made it very difficult for me to stick to victory, especially after i married and kids were filling up quite some time...

But i was usually able to find enemies which understood that and did provide me the necessary reports to keep me on my schedule ...

A thing i also do ... if someone is blinded by my own schedule, i never have any problems to unblind him by sending him the info he need.

 

Anyway...

I also tried to stop playing victory several times...

But the game and also the people i met here are still what i like a lot... so i signed in again for 101 :rolleyes:

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I think, in the beginning of victory, an AIR-factory was even producing 20 AIR per turn - that was really dis-balanced :python:

 

I think our gamers-group is small enough and won't grow anymore... and i really don't think that somebody is really using clear bugs for an advantage.

I heard from this morale-bombing-things, but i was never the target of one and i think that also has stopped.

 

The blinding tactics is used in this game and it's not a crime. Nevertheless, i don't like it.

It made it very difficult for me to stick to victory, especially after i married and kids were filling up quite some time...

But i was usually able to find enemies which understood that and did provide me the necessary reports to keep me on my schedule ...

A thing i also do ... if someone is blinded by my own schedule, i never have any problems to unblind him by sending him the info he need.

 

Anyway...

I also tried to stop playing victory several times...

But the game and also the people i met here are still what i like a lot... so i signed in again for 101 :rolleyes:

“(I think our gamers-group is small enough and won't grow anymore...)” I think our little community is way too small and needs to grow desperately!!!

 

“(I heard from this morale-bombing-things,… i think that also has stopped.)”

Russ put a stop to this by removing the ability to kill off population. This issue was breaking the game balance massively! The FC “Bug” is no place close to even start looking like it might be at that level. In fact, the FC “Bug” fits so perfectly in with the spirit of why the FC rule was massively expanded 22 years ago (see below). This is why I do not see it as a “Bug” no matter how much it technically is.

 

“(The blinding tactics is used in this game and it's not a crime. Nevertheless, i don't like it….

A thing i also do ... if someone is blinded by my own schedule, i never have any problems to unblind him by sending him the info he need.)”

Cool, In G#100 you and Baltic State are in my blind spot (possibly C.Russia also). Please send me your reports so that I can be unblended, Thanks a lot J. (You have my e-mail)

 

Victory! Rules Addendum, As of May, 1995

The rationale behind the fighter cover rule change was to give fighters greater value within the game system. Tactical strike capable aircraft, currently, enjoy the most advantages and are the most popular aircraft. Fighter groups cannot cover enough territory with Intercept missions and, under the old rules, Fighter Cover missions did not allow the fighters to protect their base and army/naval forces at the same time. If the fighters attempt to protect ground forces against tactical strikes, they were vulnerable to tactical base strikes. If they protected their base, the ground forces were vulnerable. The new fighter cover rule gives fighters the ability to effectively cover a great deal more territory and to counter a wide range of attacks. The end result should be an increase in fighter popularity and usage which will, in turn, reduce the effectiveness of tactical strike aircraft through higher losses, etc. (Note: We received numerous suggestions on changes that could balance the air system by cutting into the advantages enjoyed by tactical strike aircraft. This approach, we felt, offered a good chance of balancing the system without drastic changes that would have affected other systems and required much more development work to implement. The change also made a lot of sense since the old fighter cover rules were quite restrictive. Thanks to all those who took the time to offer their input.)

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@Spartan: You are probably right good sir :laugh: . Still, it does not hurt to be sure :) .

 

ALMOST THERE!!!!! :woohoo:

Game currently 90% Full

Here are the currently available nations:

Germany

Greece
Hungary

Norway

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