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Dr.0
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I am a little irritated by the lack of sensibility of some players about the the limited finances of RTG. In particular, reading the fighter and drones topic gave me the impression that some number of players are hinting that they will quit the game due to unclear rules. I will start by saying all of the following is just speculation, but I hope is not too far off.

 

First, how much money does Supernova actually bring into RTG? For discussion sake, I will guess that there are 200 active empires and that each empire submits 1.5 turn sheets every two weeks. That means that RTG gets $6 * 200 * 1.5 = $1800 every two weeks or that Russ and Pete each would get $1800 a month before taxes and expenses from Supernova. That is not alot of income. Of course Victory will add to that, but that dies off as players drop fairly rapidly in each game.

 

So, I am guessing that much of Russ and Petes time every two weeks goes to processing turns and answering players questions via this board, e-mail, and telephone. I believe they do not have much (if any) time to make desired improvements to the documentation and to the software.

 

Second, I run three empires (2 turn 0 and one new position). I, like most everyone else, did not realize the effect of fire control in combat. So, what is my solution? Spend a few turns with each elder race to build command ships with lots of FCS and Subspace comm gear - Presto, my fleets now have (or soon will have) decent fire control.

 

The complaints about fighters and drones just do not make sense. Yes if you attack someone without adequate PD with fighters drones or missles, you will win. But at the same point if you attack with Type D Plasma Torps the same thing will happen. The whole combat system is a rock, paper, scissors situation. If only one side of a battle has the appropriate defensive systems, they should win.

 

So, as a defender, I have picket ships far out from the home system to detect potential hostiles and my first enemy will not see my best weapon system until he gets to my homeworld. If a hostle fleet has weapons that I do not have adequate defensives for - then I am prepared to dedicate all 25 rc will be researching those defensives.

 

Why should we have perfect knowlege of the game system and how our equipment will perform against the enemy. In the real world we wouldn't. For example, in WW2, the Germans got a nasty surprise in the T-34 and Japanese Long Lance Torpedo and Zero fighter dominated early in the war.

 

Perhaps a better example comes form the history of the battleship. In the last half of the 19th century ironclad and steam driven warships were developed. But what was the best design? They are a number of strange designs from that period as the naval architects trie ddifferent ideas. The strangest may have the Russian circular monitor Novgorod. Nobody knew what would work best. There were no battle between ironclad fleets from 1866 (Lissa) until 1904 (Tsushima). The lessons learned from Lissa (dominance of ram) turned out to be wrong and when the Japanese destroyed the Russians at Tsushima with a numericallly inferior fleet, the lesson of the importance of big guns was learned and shortly thereafter the dreadnought was born in most navies. But it took the actual fleet engagement to learn what was effective. The same should occur in a good game.

 

So, use the game system to learn about the game. And when you have made a bad guess, you can fix it.

 

Respectfully,

Jack

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:cheers: Here's to you Jack. I agree wholeheartedly. Having fought most of my wars quite a few years ago, I have come to the realization that life is too short to go through it doing something you really do not enjoy. I for one thoroughly enjoy this game. If I did not, or if I was upset all the time and frustrated, I would get the hell out.

Having spent 20 years in the Army, and 1 1/2 years in Vietnam, I can assure you that the intel we had to rely on was often so far off that we did on occasion walk into a trap. That is part of being at war with someone. Your not sure what they have and you really hope that they do not know what you have.

And, If someone did whip your butt, you could always take what you have learned and start a new empire and not make the same mistakes.

Also, since when is it anybodies bussiness how much money Pete and Russ make?

Now where is my damn Bloodwine----KURASSIER :)

 

Kahless :taz:

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Kahless,

You are absolutely right that it is no one's business about the finances of Pete and Russ. I was not asking - just speculating to give some perspective to those that are upset about the lack of progress on game improvements. That there are good reasons that the best PBM company cannot be perfect.

Jack

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Dr O.

 

If you look at the board posts that complain they usually have the same players in each one. There are numerous players who never even go to the boards (I have run into 2), others like myself who rarely post, some who get information and several who just need to complain all the time... Yes there are flaws. If you don't like them go elsewhere....

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I don't mind rants.

 

I think discussing the game is an important feature and anybody who plays it has a right to express their concerns.

 

With that said, it can get exhausting to hear nothing but complaints.

 

This board used to be a little more jovial....for some reason the roleplayers have ducked off the boards (slowly) and the tone has been more focused on game flaws.

 

I also agree with most of what Jack and Kahless have to say.

 

It never hurts to look at the big picture.

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This board used to be a little more jovial....for some reason the roleplayers have ducked off the boards (slowly) and the tone has been more focused on game flaws.

SOme of us are still here. :)

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Dr. O,

 

I believe you are missing the point of some of the posts concerning Fighters & Drones. It is not one of misunderstanding or overestimating the efficacy of certain technologies, it is one of not having a clear understanding of how the combat engine actually works, which is indicative of the fact that the documentation (e.g. Rules) has lagged severely behind the rest of the game development.

 

Valwyn suggested that we "suspend" the game for two weeks (one cycle) to let Pete and Russ catch up on bug fixes and documentation. I'm not sure if that would be enough time for them to catch up on the documentation, because they still have Victory! turns to run, plus not everyone would be keen on "donating a turn for the cause" to keep the revenue stream that RTG needs going. (For all I know about RTG's fiscal state, it could be run as a Not-For-Profit Corporation.)

 

FWIW,

-SK :)

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This board used to be a little more jovial....for some reason the roleplayers have ducked off the boards (slowly) and the tone has been more focused on game flaws.

Some of us are still here. :)

 

Ebb and Flow of the Tide ...

 

Right now people are fighting wars and how combat works is more important than "intrigues around the capital".

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I have no problem with not (currently) given rules, but with plain misinformation in the ANZ of items.

e.g. take Mk I computer systems, you do not need more than one. That was plain false.

 

You can guess right or wrong, if nothing is given, but that is your own decision, but if you have

information in the game on which you cannot count, that was not my decision.

 

But as said earlier, the thing with fire control can be fixed easily.

 

Cestvel

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i defintiely appricate the efforts that pete and russ go through to bring this game together. its hard work making the equations and trying to make a perfect balance. The fact that there is a strategy game where tech speed doesn't play such a big role is amazing. the patience that they have demonstrated in designing and improving such a game is admirable. i enjoy the fruits of their labor and will continue to enjoy sn:rote and probably victory once i get the chance.

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Certainly a valid point. My only 'complaint' about F&D, was that I didn't see how fighters could come through a WP on their own without a Jump Drive. Still doesn't make sense to me, but oh well.

I for one have no intention of dropping because of lack of clarity. I don't need actual numbers or anything such thing as that, but I think the information that Fighters make it through WP without a Jump drive is something that even my dumbest engineers would have figured out, without the need for an actual battle.

 

and yes, we will learn a lot from battles, as we already have. I'm just glad I'm getting most of my knowledge from somebody else's losses. :)

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SOme of us are still here.

 

Nice :huh:

 

 

and yes, we will learn a lot from battles, as we already have. I'm just glad I'm getting most of my knowledge from somebody else's losses.

 

:cheers: Losing in this game is frustrating....but at least the game is open-ended enough to allow you to go back to the drawing board and counter what killed you :cheers: I can rarely see a situation where someone might be at a complete loss with how to avenge your first loss :)

 

Keeps ya guessing :taz:

 

 

My only 'complaint' about F&D, was that I didn't see how fighters could come through a WP on their own without a Jump Drive.

 

I look at Fighters and Drones as little gnats that sneak int othe warp bubbles of the larger ship and warp through? I dunno? :cheers:

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ack. ok. think of it this way....

 

 

the ships all enter the warp point at once...

 

however they can only be released in portions...

 

like pouring water into an open mouthed jar with a tiny hole on the bottle.

 

a fighter is small enough to come throguh with out interferin gwith the exit of larger ships possibly.

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the ships all enter the warp point at once...

however they can only be released in portions...

 

like pouring water into an open mouthed jar with a tiny hole on the bottle.

 

a fighter is small enough to come throguh with out interferin gwith the exit of larger ships possibly

 

but all those other ships require a Jump Drive to enter the WP, how do the fighters do it without one?

 

I look at Fighters and Drones as little gnats that sneak int othe warp bubbles of the larger ship and warp through

 

Wouldn't this increase the warp bubble of the ship? Or if this is true, what if I have an 8 million ton ship, couldn't all of my 1000 ton screening ships do the same within the warp bubble of my large ship?

What if the WP size is 1, and your first ship through is a 1000 ton screening ship, with let's say 10,000 fighters? since the fighter itself is 100 tons, wouldn't this mass of fighters a) dwarf the 1000 ton ship, b ) shatter the 1000 ton ship's warp bubble?

Maybe I'm just dense and don't get it. :P

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