Attrition on asteroids

[Lord Xaar]

ShadowKitsune makes a good observation. There are some worlds a particular race should just not bother with (unless that race has invested in a fair amount of good colonization tech).

 

The Ring spent a lot of time 'testing' out colonization strategies. Much to the eternal dismay of our brave, but terribly foolhardy, frontiers people. Subterrean cities were seen to have a great impact in attrition, but not enough...

 

A mass exodus to return home was recently completed, and our scientists ponder other technological paths.

 

 

-LX

[EternusIV]

I have insane colonization bonuses.....but....I'd never camp a belt (Foot=attrition)

 

I've also developed some pretty decent Horizon techs and the CMs to build some of the new-fangled installations to help improve colonization.

 

IMHExperience: even the mad colonizers have limits. I think lifefrom attrition is one of the more balanced features of SNROTE, personally.

 

Let us know how the belt-mining ops go!

 

(Wouldnt it be cool to mine asteriod belts for ore like in Eve-Online with certain ship components like minig lasers?)

[Hughestrog]

I have insane colonization bonuses.....but....I'd never camp a belt    (Foot=attrition)

 

I've also developed some pretty decent Horizon techs and the CMs to build some of the new-fangled installations to help improve colonization. 

 

IMHExperience: even the mad colonizers have limits.  I think lifefrom attrition is one of the more balanced features of SNROTE, personally.

 

Let us know how the belt-mining ops go!

 

(Wouldnt it be cool to mine asteriod belts for ore like in Eve-Online with certain ship components like minig lasers?)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

All depends on the starting temp of the HW. With Domed cities, asteroid belts are no problem. Now 273K Terrestials, that's another thing.

[ShadowKitsune]

I have to disagree a bit with my floral colleague. I think Attrition works okay, but because of it's dependence on your HW value, which seems to be utterly random, it is not balanced.

 

If you built a race with Low Temperature and Very Low Gravity Tolerance and started on a Frozen Rockball with a nominal gravity [1G], you'd be fabulous at colonizing Asteroid Belts with minimal investiture. However, if that same race started on a Hot Rockball with extreme gravity [3G], you'd be screwed if you tried to colonize an Asteroid Field.

 

I have yet to see any evidence that leads me to believe that your racial design plays any factor at all in your HW/Home System placement.

 

-SK

[EternusIV]

Excellent points, both!

 

I had never considered the fortune of having a similar starting temp to asteroid belts -- and I'm not entirely sure that would work out to an overwhelming advantage. I have insane amounts of planetary data and I've promised myself to take some time one of these days and break down the percentages of my finds (in terms of nearly every category)...and I'm not sure how USEFUL such information would be in the long run anyway

 

I see now that I could be wrong in thinking that there are equal colonization opportunities for any empire's natural temperature range. I guess the next question is: if you're naturally good at mining belts, does that unbalance everything? [Ponderous Smiley]

 

I haven't seen any correlation at all to species design and starting HW. I'm 99.9% sure its completely random.

[Hughestrog]

I guess the next question is:  if you're naturally good at mining belts, does that unbalance everything?  [Ponderous Smiley]

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Still depends upon a lot of things: how common are belts in your neighbourhood; how many systems away are they, etc. Although generally very good in iron and crystals, you don't find much meat or grain on a belt.

[ali-t-akua]

I guess the next question is:  if you're naturally good at mining belts, does that unbalance everything?  [Ponderous Smiley]

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Still depends upon a lot of things: how common are belts in your neighbourhood; how many systems away are they, etc. Although generally very good in iron and crystals, you don't find much meat or grain on a belt.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Considering that iron and crystals seem to be about 75% of what is needed to build stuff, this can be a significant advantage assuming that you have lots of belts nearby.

[ShadowKitsune]

I guess the next question is:  if you're naturally good at mining belts, does that unbalance everything?  [Ponderous Smiley]

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Still depends upon a lot of things: how common are belts in your neighbourhood; how many systems away are they, etc. Although generally very good in iron and crystals, you don't find much meat or grain on a belt.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well ... in order for something to create imbalance in a system, the system would have to be in balance in the first place and I'm sure that there are people out there that would argue that SN:ROTE has never been in balance.

 

The ability to "colonize" Asteroid Fields in an effective manner would be a seriously useful ability, especially considering the utility of Iron, Light Metals and Crystals in SN:ROTE. Does it throw the game out of balance? Not any more so than starting on a Homeworld with high values in those three resources would, IMO.

 

-SK

[General Miles Avatar]

I guess the next question is:  if you're naturally good at mining belts, does that unbalance everything?  [Ponderous Smiley]

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Still depends upon a lot of things: how common are belts in your neighbourhood; how many systems away are they, etc. Although generally very good in iron and crystals, you don't find much meat or grain on a belt.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well ... in order for something to create imbalance in a system, the system would have to be in balance in the first place and I'm sure that there are people out there that would argue that SN:ROTE has never been in balance.

 

The ability to "colonize" Asteroid Fields in an effective manner would be a seriously useful ability, especially considering the utility of Iron, Light Metals and Crystals in SN:ROTE. Does it throw the game out of balance? Not any more so than starting on a Homeworld with high values in those three resources would, IMO.

 

-SK

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

With the new bonuses for installations even our crappy colonizers can succesfully colonize an asteroid belt now. Of course they would need all of the installations

most notably the subterranean city but Im not complaining.

 

Seems RTG saw that races with MASSIVE colonization bonuses would have a

severe advantage over races that couldnt colonize as well. The sheer efficiency

granted would enable the colonizer to way outproduce a non colonizer.

[Eldred]

With the new bonuses for installations even our crappy colonizers can succesfully colonize an asteroid belt now. Of course they would need all of the installations

most notably the subterranean city but Im not complaining.

 

Seems RTG saw that races with MASSIVE colonization bonuses would have a

severe advantage over races that couldnt colonize as well. The sheer efficiency

granted would enable the colonizer to way outproduce a non colonizer.

 

I thought that was the whole idea of spending your SRPs on colonisation bonuses instead of "brain in a jar" type bonuses. IMHO those races that chose to spend all of their bonuses on research should expect colonization to be tough.

[ShadowKitsune]

Colonization just got easier for a lot of races, mine included.

 

Plus, the Linear Accelerator seems to give everyone a "smarts" structure.

 

Textiles now have a function as well. Who would have thought that was going to happen?

 

This will take a while to absorb fully. (Or "grok" for all of my fellow sci-fi grognards. )

 

-SK

[ali-t-akua]

I guess the next question is: if you're naturally good at mining belts, does that unbalance everything? [Ponderous Smiley]

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Still depends upon a lot of things: how common are belts in your neighbourhood; how many systems away are they, etc. Although generally very good in iron and crystals, you don't find much meat or grain on a belt.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well ... in order for something to create imbalance in a system, the system would have to be in balance in the first place and I'm sure that there are people out there that would argue that SN:ROTE has never been in balance.

 

The ability to "colonize" Asteroid Fields in an effective manner would be a seriously useful ability, especially considering the utility of Iron, Light Metals and Crystals in SN:ROTE. Does it throw the game out of balance? Not any more so than starting on a Homeworld with high values in those three resources would, IMO.

 

-SK

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

With the new bonuses for installations even our crappy colonizers can succesfully colonize an asteroid belt now. Of course they would need all of the installations

most notably the subterranean city but Im not complaining.

 

Seems RTG saw that races with MASSIVE colonization bonuses would have a

severe advantage over races that couldnt colonize as well. The sheer efficiency

granted would enable the colonizer to way outproduce a non colonizer.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

With the new bonuses for installations even our crappy colonizers can succesfully colonize an asteroid belt now. Of course they would need all of the installations

most notably the subterranean city but Im not complaining.

 

Seems RTG saw that races with MASSIVE colonization bonuses would have a

severe advantage over races that couldnt colonize as well. The sheer efficiency

granted would enable the colonizer to way outproduce a non colonizer.

 

I thought that was the whole idea of spending your SRPs on colonisation bonuses instead of "brain in a jar" type bonuses. IMHO those races that chose to spend all of their bonuses on research should expect colonization to be tough.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I agree Eldred. Part of the game was balancing colonization versus research and this change modifies that trade off. Of course Pete has provided the Linear Accelerator to compensate. In addition I noticed that many of the enhancements are focused on helping to attract more people to the empire which I assume means that there will be increased pop growth so I am also wondering if that may have been an additional consderation in implementing this set of changes

[General Miles Avatar]

I guess the next question is: if you're naturally good at mining belts, does that unbalance everything? [Ponderous Smiley]

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Still depends upon a lot of things: how common are belts in your neighbourhood; how many systems away are they, etc. Although generally very good in iron and crystals, you don't find much meat or grain on a belt.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well ... in order for something to create imbalance in a system, the system would have to be in balance in the first place and I'm sure that there are people out there that would argue that SN:ROTE has never been in balance.

 

The ability to "colonize" Asteroid Fields in an effective manner would be a seriously useful ability, especially considering the utility of Iron, Light Metals and Crystals in SN:ROTE. Does it throw the game out of balance? Not any more so than starting on a Homeworld with high values in those three resources would, IMO.

 

-SK

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

With the new bonuses for installations even our crappy colonizers can succesfully colonize an asteroid belt now. Of course they would need all of the installations

most notably the subterranean city but Im not complaining.

 

Seems RTG saw that races with MASSIVE colonization bonuses would have a

severe advantage over races that couldnt colonize as well. The sheer efficiency

granted would enable the colonizer to way outproduce a non colonizer.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

With the new bonuses for installations even our crappy colonizers can succesfully colonize an asteroid belt now. Of course they would need all of the installations

most notably the subterranean city but Im not complaining.

 

Seems RTG saw that races with MASSIVE colonization bonuses would have a

severe advantage over races that couldnt colonize as well. The sheer efficiency

granted would enable the colonizer to way outproduce a non colonizer.

 

I thought that was the whole idea of spending your SRPs on colonisation bonuses instead of "brain in a jar" type bonuses. IMHO those races that chose to spend all of their bonuses on research should expect colonization to be tough.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I agree Eldred. Part of the game was balancing colonization versus research and this change modifies that trade off. Of course Pete has provided the Linear Accelerator to compensate. In addition I noticed that many of the enhancements are focused on helping to attract more people to the empire which I assume means that there will be increased pop growth so I am also wondering if that may have been an additional consderation in implementing this set of changes

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

If you set up a brain in a jar your still going to hurt if you try to colonize.

Lots of setups only had a few disadvantages and those few made it lethal

on most worlds unless they were very close to HW norms.

 

These changes level the field a little bit and if you can already colonize look out!

You guys just got a nitrous boost.

[ali-t-akua]

If you set up a brain in a jar your still going to hurt if you try to colonize.

Lots of setups only had a few disadvantages and those few made it lethal

on most worlds unless they were very close to HW norms.

 

These changes level the field a little bit and if you can already colonize look out!

You guys just got a nitrous boost.

 

Everyone in setting up their empire had to make trade offs. Colonizers traded research and space combat for lower attrition and ground combat, BIAJs made the opposite choice and everyone traded off SRPs. As there are plenty of Colonizers and BIAJs I assume that those trade offs were balanced. I don't know what the impact of the Linear Accelerator will be on research but it looks like it favors those races with lots of scientists so in my opinion "Brain in a jars" got the better end of the deal. That is why I wondered if there might not be another reason for this change that is not evident to me.

 

For example maybe Pete felt there was not enough conflict over resources. I can see where this change could make it more likely empires would fight each other. There may be some other motivation.

 

PS I have a Colonizer race. I already have more colonization sites than my pop can support so unless I can colonize hot worlds with lumber I hardly see this as a nitrous boost.

[hobknob]

Linear Accelerators were not added recently. They have always been in the game, but the code did not point to the right thing so they never showed up. This was just a correction.

 

Don't know about the others.