First Contact

[Prospective]

A general question about first contact (or any contact) with another player (or a dropped player position).

 

Lets say I'm out there cruising around with my scout ships, surveying WP's and doing system scans (maybe a GEO, PMAP or CSV occasionally). Will my scout fleet automatically detect other (ships not of my empire) fleets? Do I need to devote an AP to doing a SENS to detect other ships? Do I need to be in the same location (eg: same WP or orbit), or will I find any other ship as long as they are located in the same system? If said scout ship has no sensors, will I simply go blindly about, never knowing if I've run across another empire? Does a scout ship need to have a sensor (short, medium or long) in order to detect another ship? Does a LR sensor increase chances of spotting another ship? For purposes of this discussion, let's assume that my scout fleet consists of the starting Pathfinder and so does the other fleet (I don't want factors such as cloaking devices to come in to play in this conversation, assuming cloaking devices for ships eventually gets developed).

 

I'm not saying that I believe I've reached the point where I feel I should start finding another player, but just want some reassurance that if I should run across someone, I will not need any special equipment or have to execute any special orders to detect them. Any comments on that would be appreciated.

 

Also, anyone want to share how many jumps out from their home system it took in order to run across another empire? The furthest scout I have from the HW is 4 jumps out now. What is the average distance out from a HW you can expet to find another player? Seems as though the universe is a big place and I'd welcome contact with another peaceful empire for the purpose of trading and exchange of tech items.

 

Thanks.

[Ozboym]

Sighting of other ships so far seems to always happen when you move to where their ships are or you move to theirs. You don't see them when they move away, nor do you get an update if you both stay put unless you use a SENS order to check if they're still there.

[Locklyn]

A quick answer to your questions:

 

No, you don't need sensors to detect ships, I know it sounds weird but sensors seem to primarily be just a defensive system like so many others. I've had ships that are just fuel tanks and engines have the exact same success with SENS, GEO, PMAP etc orders so just ignore what the rules say as they're completely misleading at this point with the order booklet saying that you can get better results at CSV etc if you have better equipment on the ship wich is hogwash

 

There are some sensor systems that supposedly help you detect cloaked ships but as with many other things, "seeing is believing"

 

 

Apparently the highest chance of seeing other ships are when they pass your "loaction" ie orbit, warp point etc and especially if they're doing something, same goes if you do something. Ships being completely still can only be discovered to my knowledge though the SENS order but be aware that this also exposes your ship sort of like painting a target

 

I ran across my first Empire some four warps out, ie their ship bumped ito mine and to date have encountered some 12 Empires in my region most of which unfortunately seem to dropping out of the game at an alarming pace.

 

My suggestion to you which I have done is to have every WP within 4-6 jumps out from your homeworld covered with ships doing XSENS, thus you'll find an approaching fleet quickly. Cloaked ships will pass you by but so far noone can afford to cloak an assault fleet with only the higher versions of cloak helping out.

 

For the two or three nearest systems I would put a concerted effort into having a lot of ships on XSENS perhaps even over Gas Giants

 

For your home world system, do not ever skirt having massive amounts of fleets on each WP.

 

Also be aware that since SENS and sighting reports are weird and strangely placed on your turn to scour through it with a magnifying glass since you can easily miss something when your turn starts to run to 300 pages like mine

 

Cheers and good luck!

 

/Locklyn

[Krelnett_of_Kraan]

Cloaked ships will pass you by but so far noone can afford to cloak an assault fleet with only the higher versions of cloak helping out.

/Locklyn

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Care to reveal the path to cloaking technology? We've gotten EXPL hits on a couple varieties but no working models to ANZ.

[Laserwolf]

so just ignore what the rules say as they're completely misleading at this point with the order booklet saying that you can get better results at GEO CSV etc if you have better equipment on the ship wich is hogwash

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Then again, "better results" means different things to different people. These systems do assist you in finding "cooler and better stuff" when you EXPL. I guess, to some, this small advantage is equivalent to "hogwash"

[Locklyn]

Laserwolf:

 

I was speaking directly about the SENS issue here since this was brought up and whether sensors was needed. And despite what the rule booklet says about better equipment giving you better results for things like the CSV order there is no such thing today to indicate that it works that way in the game today I was not in any word of my text speaking about EXPL neither was Prospective in what he asked but perhaps you are confusing this thread with another?

 

 

Btw from the Orders Supplement

 

CSV:

Survey teams are assumed to be present on all of your Fleets, but superior equipment, lifeform features and Legendary Characters can affect the

accuracy of this mission.

 

Sheer hogwash, as I've had the exact results with a superior teams as well a ship consisting of just an engine

 

/Locklyn

[Locklyn]

Krelnet,

Sorry no go on design as they're all very busy over PA homeworlds, lot less of those to go around these days it seems

 

Cheers

 

/Locklyn

[Prospective]

Locklyn,

 

In your first reply, you state:

 

"For the two or three nearest systems I would put a concerted effort into having a lot of ships on XSENS perhaps even over Gas Giants"

 

What I read into that is that for systems real close to the HW, persistent SENS'ing with a lot of ships is your recommendation. However, what about ground bases? Since they have an ID number associated with them (just like a fleet), and they consist of the same components that ships do (except for engines), can I put 2 or 3 small ground bases in a system (consisting of sensors/computer systems primarily) and give them XSENS orders? Since they don't have AP's, how would that work? Do you assume 2AP per GB? Or will that fail completely?

 

Then you say:

 

"For your home world system, do not ever skirt having massive amounts of fleets on each WP."

 

In what kind of timeframe would you recommend going to that status? I've only been in the game since the end of September and have never spotted another player empire. Seems to me that until I actually find someone, why go to those measures?

 

Thanks.

Steve

[Locklyn]

Prospective,

 

Actually I do believe a groundbase would work. Never thought of it that way and have always preferred to have fleets at WPs so I can get the higher sighting factor, also I've seeded just about every system that I have come across with small inexpensive SENS ships at every WP just to ensure no breadcrumb trail is left. A ground base is a fleet in every sense but the fact that it cannot move. It always has two AP. As I said before unless you have special sensors for detecting cloaked ships there is no need to put either sensors (they're a defensive system only) or computers (ignore the blurb about them making all other systems work better, seems to be just fluff, they're simply Fire Control items) on those bases. I am hoping the forthcoming (yes, I still believe it will be coming soon) Naval Combat Document will go into details on detection and ranges.

 

As for your second question, it rather depends on how paranoid one is I built warships since day one of the game, since we had even less information then than now every design and ship has since then been scrapped since they sucked You never ever want to get caught having to react slowly to an incoming hostile, nor do you wish to seem lacking in means of either defense or retaliation. Keep a destroyer screen a couple of systems out to prevent a fast scout from SURVing into your core territory too quickly, ensure you use System Probes to make it damn clear when they've crossed a border.

 

Another thing that is highly underused is the convoy route system for defensive patrols. Set up a border which is your point of no crossing, design some fairly good ships that you have going to and forth that border in a convoy route. Thus you always have a fluid line of ships across your border, mobility being the key here and as you add ships to the convouy route you can ensure you add them at different priorities thus ending up with always having at least one fleet in every system you deem important.

 

Good luck and good hunting

 

/Locklyn

[ali-t-akua]

Locklyn, great advice. I am doing some of what you suggest but the convoy route idea was one I had not thought of.

[Prospective]

Locklyn,

 

Thanks for the good advice, it's much appreciated.

 

Regarding the SENS order, you mentioned "but be aware that this also exposes your ship sort of like painting a target".

 

Are you saying that if I have a ship in system (does it matter whether it's in orbit or at a WP??) and issue a SENS order, it will announce it's presence to any other ship that may be in the same system, even if the other ship hasn't issued a SENS orders?

 

And, will a SENS order find any other uncloaked ship in the entire system (including both WP's and orbits)??? Are these absolutes, or only % chances that something will be revealed? If a % chance, then you are saying the chance of success increases if the SENS is issued by a ship at a WP??

[Ur Lord Tedric]

Locklyn,

 

Thanks for the good advice, it's much appreciated.

 

Regarding the SENS order, you mentioned "but be aware that this also exposes your ship sort of like painting a target".

 

Are you saying that if I have a ship in system (does it matter whether it's in orbit or at a WP??) and issue a SENS order, it will announce it's presence to any other ship that may be in the same system, even if the other ship hasn't issued a SENS orders? 

 

And, will a SENS order find any other uncloaked ship in the entire system (including both WP's and orbits)???  Are these absolutes, or only % chances that something will be revealed?  If a % chance, then you are saying the chance of success increases if the SENS is issued by a ship at a WP??

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Thus far it seems that fleet sightings only occur at the same locations - there doesn't seem to be any really longer ranged sensors......

 

Chief Warmaster to Ur-Lord Tedric

[Prospective]

So, what you are saying is that if I had a fleet in orbit around a planet, I'd never see a ship at a warp point? And vice versa?

 

What if the fleet in planetary orbit conduted a SENS? Would it only provide info on another fleet in the same orbit? Would it provide info on any fleet in the system (including WP's)?

 

Please explain with small words cause I'm not sure I understand.

 

Thanks.

[Hughestrog]

The advantage of having a fleet on XSENS rather than a ground base is that to construct a ground base you need a shipyard on the planet to build the base. Whereas with the fleet, you make them on the HW (or where ever) then send them to their destination.

[Locklyn]

Prospective,

 

From what I've understood sighting may occur when a ship passes through a location with another fleet present or does an action like performing an XSENS that will create a report on the other players turn. There are ways to be real sneaky with this if you think about it

 

/Locklyn