Research Effectiveness

[tigeriith]

I am a newbie and trying to gauge how effective my research is progressing and cannot find any concrete metrics to us. There seems to be some information but none that can be used in an analytical way.

 

1) How effective is my race at research -- The research ability on the Life Form modifiers part of the report has no scale -- how do I determine what my basic reasearch out put is in Research Points per turn?

 

2) On the Research report does each "-" represent one research point expended or a certain percentage of the total required -- I am new and most of my research has been done on "12 point" categories so can't really tell if a "-" is a point or 5 percent?

 

3) Any other tips on quantifying the percentage increase from various characters and installations?

 

Thanks for the help

[hobknob]

Each -- on the report is about 10% completed. This will already take into account your RB and any scientist hits that might have gotten.

 

Sometimes they go slow and other times they go fast. Exploration hits will also add to the total so it is entirely possible to start researching something for the first time and already a significant way down the path to completion if you have done a lot of exploration.

 

 

Your lifeform research bonus can only be calculated by looking at all of your lifeform choices. The bars on the turn report only give a comparison to other items. Absolute %'s and #'s are never provided and are only guessed at by the community.

 

Careful observation of your reserach completion times will give you the best answer to your question. Most of the early techs were pinned down pretty well as to research cost. Using the cost/time you can get a good idea of what has been happening. You just can't muddy the water with scientist hits or exploration hits.

 

[Octus Imperium]

From what we can tell, the average length of time to get the average first generation research completed is 11 ot 12 turns. This excludes the well know 3 turn wonders. There is roughly a multiplier effect after this, second tier taking 2*base number, 3rd tier 3* base, etc. Minor breakthroughs can be fairly meaningful and the exploration find does something, but relatively minor. Others ahve probably reduced this to more definitive math.

 

In other words, if basic first gen stuff is taking more than 12 turns to research with a single RC deployed and no breakthroughs/exploration hits, your race is probably a little slower than average. What the 'brain-in-a-jar' crowd gets is beyond my experience.

 

Octus Imperium

First Minister of Vague Research Guidance

[WKE235]

From what we can tell, the average length of time to get the average first generation research completed is 11 ot 12 turns. This excludes the well know 3 turn wonders. There is roughly a multiplier effect after this, second tier taking 2*base number, 3rd tier 3* base, etc. Minor breakthroughs can be fairly meaningful and the exploration find does something, but relatively minor. Others ahve probably reduced this to more definitive math.

 

In other words, if basic first gen stuff is taking more than 12 turns to research with a single RC deployed and no breakthroughs/exploration hits, your race is probably a little slower than average. What the 'brain-in-a-jar' crowd gets is beyond my experience.

 

Octus Imperium

First Minister of Vague Research Guidance

 

Another way to look at this Poor items take about 3-4 turns, Fair take about 10-12, etcetera .. with adequate, good, and the rest all taking more. In otherwords, the better the item, the longer the research. The exceptions are the 3 turn wonders.

 

Oh, and for R&D, placing multiple slots on a tech does cut research time. But some R&D is lost. For example, if one slot gets the tech in 10 turns, 2 slots will get it in 7-8 (depending on your R&D bonuses), 3 slots in 5-6 turns, and so on. The impact of each added slot has a lesser effect in cutting the time. On the other hand, more slots means your random scientific breakthroughs are more likely to hit that item. Only items under R&D will get breakthroughs. So if you have a tech in 5 of the 25 slots, that tech has a far higher chance to be assigned breakthrough points that some item with one slot.

 

Oh, and the brain in the jar camp gets about a 30% or so R&D boost, tops. Buying the R&D bonuses in racial design is definately not worth the tiny increases you get for all the points spent. If your race is designed to generate lots of scientists (Technocratic), you'll quickly start getting far more points in R&D breakthroughs every turn the minor R&D boost. Better to save your points and use them to buy early techs. You get up the tech ladder much faster that way.

[tigeriith]

Thank you for all the responses --I can see I was trying to be far too analytic and have to learn to live with the vagaries of research.

 

Now, since you have been so helpful, a question on a totally different topic.

 

Is the "Imperial Flag" necessary on an outpost world? I have a few worlds where have an empty population group just so EXPL ships can unload their cargo space and go on exploring. Periodically a freighter comes around to load the goodies and it issues a LC .....ALL. This picks up the goodies but also picks up the flag and they tend to accumulate on the freighter till he dumps the cargo with an OC .... ALL.

 

My outposts now have no flags. Does this matter?

[NeilGartner]

Thank you for all the responses --I can see I was trying to be far too analytic and have to learn to live with the vagaries of research.

 

Now, since you have been so helpful, a question on a totally different topic.

 

Is the "Imperial Flag" necessary on an outpost world? I have a few worlds where have an empty population group just so EXPL ships can unload their cargo space and go on exploring. Periodically a freighter comes around to load the goodies and it issues a LC .....ALL. This picks up the goodies but also picks up the flag and they tend to accumulate on the freighter till he dumps the cargo with an OC .... ALL.

 

My outposts now have no flags. Does this matter?

 

This is right from the Techology Descriptions

 

Imperial Flag: An Imperial Flag is planted on a world after a Colonial Beacon has been used to establish a new Population Group. It flies the colors of your Imperial Emblem and lets all and sundry know that you have claimed the planet for yourself. (1 ton) 5 Textiles

 

Think of the Imperial Flag as a giant No Trespassing sign. If you find a world that you want for yourself and have a competing neighbour you might want to plant them on your colonies. Simply because there is nothing to stop another player from colonizing the same planet. So unless you want someone else setting up shop on one of your colonizes, it might be wise to put one up.

[hobknob]

The Imperial flag is completely useless. The only use for them is to keep the pop group showing up on your report. Completely empty pop groups don't show up on your report and can be lost.

 

They were defaulted to be excluded on the global exclusion and should be left there IMHO. In fact I have recently moved some back to pop groups where they were picked up ages ago just for visibility of the pop group.

 

[ali-t-akua]

I am a newbie and trying to gauge how effective my research is progressing and cannot find any concrete metrics to us. There seems to be some information but none that can be used in an analytical way.

 

1) How effective is my race at research -- The research ability on the Life Form modifiers part of the report has no scale -- how do I determine what my basic reasearch out put is in Research Points per turn?

 

2) On the Research report does each "-" represent one research point expended or a certain percentage of the total required -- I am new and most of my research has been done on "12 point" categories so can't really tell if a "-" is a point or 5 percent?

 

3) Any other tips on quantifying the percentage increase from various characters and installations?

 

Thanks for the help

 

Here is my theory. I have been using the following estimates for research. Others may disagree with my numbers but my results so far have been consistent with my results

 

Each RC puts out 1 point.

 

Racial bonuses add 5% per plus. (You can figure out your bonuses from the chart on the first page.) This means that each level of intelligence is worth 10% and sensory and long life are worth 5% each.

 

Number of points required for a tech is equal to 3 times the square of the generation, so 1st generation is 3 points, 2nd is 12, 3rd is 27 and 4th and up is 48. Engine tech may be an exception but I am still testing this hypothesis. There may be other exceptions as well.

 

Multiple RCs put out research points equal to the square root of the number of RCs. (Also still under test.)

 

Breakthroughs appear to be around three to four points for a Senior Scientist or higher. (Another item I am still testing)

 

I have been testing this theory by creating a spreadsheet of techs that my RCs are currently researching and projecting the date of completion. I periodically (every 6 turns or so) update but only have had to change the date estimates when there has been a breakthrough. So far I have found I have an error of less than one turn on average. (Once in a while I find my estimate was a turn short. I have just started tracking this and had one miss in five techs.)

 

I hope this helps.

[Ixitixl]

I am a newbie and trying to gauge how effective my research is progressing and cannot find any concrete metrics to us. There seems to be some information but none that can be used in an analytical way.

 

1) How effective is my race at research -- The research ability on the Life Form modifiers part of the report has no scale -- how do I determine what my basic reasearch out put is in Research Points per turn?

 

2) On the Research report does each "-" represent one research point expended or a certain percentage of the total required -- I am new and most of my research has been done on "12 point" categories so can't really tell if a "-" is a point or 5 percent?

 

3) Any other tips on quantifying the percentage increase from various characters and installations?

 

Thanks for the help

 

Here is my theory. I have been using the following estimates for research. Others may disagree with my numbers but my results so far have been consistent with my results

 

Each RC puts out 1 point.

 

Racial bonuses add 5% per plus. (You can figure out your bonuses from the chart on the first page.) This means that each level of intelligence is worth 10% and sensory and long life are worth 5% each.

 

Number of points required for a tech is equal to 3 times the square of the generation, so 1st generation is 3 points, 2nd is 12, 3rd is 27 and 4th and up is 48. Engine tech may be an exception but I am still testing this hypothesis. There may be other exceptions as well.

 

Multiple RCs put out research points equal to the square root of the number of RCs. (Also still under test.)

 

Breakthroughs appear to be around three to four points for a Senior Scientist or higher. (Another item I am still testing)

 

I have been testing this theory by creating a spreadsheet of techs that my RCs are currently researching and projecting the date of completion. I periodically (every 6 turns or so) update but only have had to change the date estimates when there has been a breakthrough. So far I have found I have an error of less than one turn on average. (Once in a while I find my estimate was a turn short. I have just started tracking this and had one miss in five techs.)

 

I hope this helps.

 

Ali-t-akua

 

Your theory is sound, the numbers are about equal to what I get.

[tigeriith]

I appreciate all the help here and am just trying to understand it. Why do you say that Intelligence is worth 10% and sensory is worth 5% when in the official rules manual they each just show up as a one,two three plus sequence (depending on level). Is this a case of (to paraphrase Freddy the Pig in "Animal Farm") "All pluses are created equal but some are more equal than others." The disparity sure makes sense as intelligence is much more expensive.

[Laserwolf]

I appreciate all the help here and am just trying to understand it. Why do you say that Intelligence is worth 10% and sensory is worth 5% when in the official rules manual they each just show up as a one,two three plus sequence (depending on level). Is this a case of (to paraphrase Freddy the Pig in "Animal Farm") "All pluses are created equal but some are more equal than others." The disparity sure makes sense as intelligence is much more expensive.

 

All pluses are absolutely NOT equal.

They are relative at best.

[hobknob]

To further the good comment from Laserwolf, plussed are only relative within the same lifeform category. So, the pluses in sensory area are fairly relative to other sensory pluses, but that is it. to make things even more fun, the relative pluses are not even the same in different areas within the same lifeform category. A single + could mean a wide variety of different things for the same item.

 

It wasn't meant to make sense or to ba figured out easily.

 

[Lord Uriel]

As Hobknob and a few others have implied, there are a few details of the game that are unknown. The reason as stated by Pete over the years is to prevent people from reverse engineering game mechanics. There are/have been several players with significant mathematic or computing ability who have figured quite a few things out. What alll those +'s may mean represents in part the fog of war.

 

 

Lord Uriel

[tigeriith]

This old brain is foggy enough on its own and doesn't need the "SuperNova theory of Plus Realativity" to confuse it further.

 

Thanks for the information -- sounds like I should be researching a Mk IV Fog Horn.

[cestvel]

But if you gather all plusses on Research you get a 50% bonus to Research. A 3 RC item completes after 2 turns with 1 RC set to it.

 

And to paraprase Pete: a plus is worth more if it costs more.