Emporer Magara Posted September 24, 2003 Report Share Posted September 24, 2003 In the early days of computers people would input information and the computer would just sit there. People didnt know if it had lock up or was working untill in spit out answear. Hince the blinking lights beeps ect. to provide feed back to the human operator. I would like to see the Reseach Report do somthing to. As it now is you can sit a read it for months and months and not know it your geting any where. Emporer Magara Aslan Heirate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laserwolf Posted September 24, 2003 Report Share Posted September 24, 2003 OF course we all would love estimated completion times, accumulated research in more likely to occur.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowKitsune Posted September 24, 2003 Report Share Posted September 24, 2003 I think it would somewhat difficult to generate an estimated time of completion because of two factors: Factor 1 - You can assign up to 25 RCs to a single research item. That's a bunch of number crunching and a lengthy report to give you the results based on all 25 possibilities. Factor 2 - Research bonanzas in the form of EXPL finds or Scientist LC breakthroughs. Admittedly, you could probably get the program to spit out a table for all research currently in the queue and assume no breakthroughs will occur, giving you 'worst case' scenarios. As long as we're wishing, I'd like both. :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobknob Posted September 24, 2003 Report Share Posted September 24, 2003 While both options would be nice I doubt either will see the light of day. What I would like to see is for my scientists to have another function as well as assisting in research. This new function would be to give some information on something you are researching. Possible results could be an estimate as to how far along things are 1/4 1/2 3/4 etc.., a partial description of somthing we have found or gotten research bonus for - this could be an indication of what the T'Ckon 68 is, or some other stuff that would spice up your turn and would not be exploitable as it would be random. Tha same thing could be said of many other characters. I would love to get a note from my archbishop that "the people want mor cathedrals" or soomething. Even if I ignored them it would spice things up a bit. Just a bit of fluff that would be nice to have - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LenLorek Posted September 25, 2003 Report Share Posted September 25, 2003 I know SNROTE is just a game, and isn't meant to be a simulation, but ... I like things to be credible/realistic -- or as nearly so as a space-faring race of bushes can attain !! If you have done something before, you will know how long it will take and what resources you need. Otherwise you can only guess/estimate, and usually you are wrong -- eg, my half-day engine rebuild took three days! So, researching a new technology should be the same -- you won't know how long it will take. The fact that we can ANZ the technology to find out what resources we need is a failing of the game, in my opinion. But I can live with it! Len "The Bush Administration" #4710 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
octagon999 Posted September 25, 2003 Report Share Posted September 25, 2003 I agree with hobnob completely. It would be nice to have other types of "breakthroughs". The idea of your scientist telling you "I think that it will take x amount of time to finish that Improved Construction Materials research at this pace" would be a nice perk without affecting research. So hits could be liberalized somewhat. Other game clues by other experts would be nice too, in their area of expertise. Such as was suggested... the Archbishop could say "Your First Citizenshipness, if we had more Cathedrals, <fill in blanks here>." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOTEC Posted September 25, 2003 Report Share Posted September 25, 2003 Estimated time to completion of research projects would be easy to come up with... ( Research Points Left / Research Points Generated Last Turn ) +/- a margin of error (possibly compounded each turn) ...and would not create too much computation (I guess) or virtual paper - this is a column of data on a reformated Research Report - or even just a bracketed addition to the existing report. I think this is closer to reality, as real as a Space Opera gets, rather than having cumulative points research that indicate nothing, unless your race had "outside" knowledge; Cumulative Research Chief Scientist: We have built the Frostgun, just got to plug it in and it will be ready. Emperor: Wonderful, how long will it take to complete? Chief Scientist: Don't know Guv. But my dreams tell me 2.6 Months. Time to Completion Chief Scientist: We have built the Frostgun, just got to plug it in and it will be ready. Emperor: Smashing, how long will it take to complete? Chief Scientist: One to two months depending on the number of tea breaks we have. If RTG went down this road then why not add an estimated time for research to all Researchable Items. But in its current format this might take the surprise of research developments from a turn? Would one of the elements of fun and mystery be removed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternusIV Posted September 25, 2003 Report Share Posted September 25, 2003 Question: How long will it take for humans on Earth to develop a Mk I Nuclear Jump Drive? If you can answer that, I presume you already have a great job. If not, send me a PM and we'll do lunch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobknob Posted September 25, 2003 Report Share Posted September 25, 2003 I don't see any sort of order being possible , but a random scientist effect would not unbalance things. The point is more along the line that a little fluff that might just be a bit useful would be nice and would increase the unexpected niftiness of your turn. As it is now most of what I see is that my emperor has helped increase water production from 19,000 to 24,000 tons. While this is all well and good, it isn't very exciting any more. Gettting a blurb that some senior scientist thinks it may take another 35 turns of research at current funding levels could be a little exciting. What could also be a little exciting was to be able to get part of the ANZ for an item that you have research points in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOTEC Posted September 25, 2003 Report Share Posted September 25, 2003 How long will it take for humans on Earth to develop a Mk I Nuclear Jump Drive? 258 Years. If you can answer that, I presume you already have a great job. If not, send me a PM and we'll do lunch. It's in the post. More seriously if something has made it onto the Researchable Items list, you can argue that it is theoretically modelled and probably modelled practically to an extent. Otherwise how can your race be so certain that the research objective will result in success? Thus from that work your race can guess the level of further work required. Maybe the difference between us is the margin of error to apply? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowKitsune Posted September 25, 2003 Report Share Posted September 25, 2003 I think we left the point that Magara originally had for requesting the information concerning research items - feedback for error-correction. It wasn't for it's 'niftiness' quotient. It would be one thing if the Research Model was based on the 'Eureka!' Principle. Where everything in the game as a Research Point Cost, but instead of discovering said item when your Research Point Total was greater than the Cost, you could theoretically get it earlier through a randomized number from 1 to 100 [inclusive] compared against the percentage complete value of the item. For example- Say Razor Wire requires 1000 RPs maximum to achieve and the number of Research Centers that you have assigned to it generate 10 RPs per turn. On your first turn, you have a 1% chance of 'Eureka!' - if the random number is a 1 ... Huzzah! You have Razor Wire. On your tenth turn, you have a 10% chance - if the random number is a 10 or less ... Huzzah! You have Razor Wire. On your hundreth turn, assuming you haven't made a breakthrough prior to this point, you have a 100% chance of 'Eureka!' - no random number needs to be generated. However, that's not the case, as I understand it. Each item that can be researched has a fixed value and once you have earned more research points that said value, you achieve a breakthrough. Unfortunately, I know some players that have achieved the unknown value, but did not achieve the breakthrough. Only after they mentioned to Pete that they thought 22 turns of research on Razor Wire seemed a bit excessive did the error get found. Its not about spiffiness, its about de-bugging. SN:ROTE was a preemie due to a variety of factors, so there are a few more bugs in it then any of us would like, including Pete and Russ. So, in a sense, we're playtesting (would that be paytesting since we're paying for it, too? :lol: ) the game. We don't have a set of tables that tell us how much each item 'costs' in research points which leaves this as the next best thing. -SK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternusIV Posted September 26, 2003 Report Share Posted September 26, 2003 I was being a smart-ass of course about the whole Earth research thing We already know how longearly tech takes in SNROTE don't we? 10-12 turns for Improved Goods/Mk 1/1st tier Horizons.... 22-25 turns for Advanced Goods/Mk 2/2nd tier Horizons..... 4-12 turns for 1st tier ground forces/ship based weapons..... 10-25 turns for 2nd tier ground forces/ship based weapons..... (all figures presume 1 Research Center per item researched) The game isn't old enough to work on third tier stuff yet But I'll let you know in about 10 turns (yup -- around 36-38 turns....) The error thing is a concern, though - if you don't have other players to bounce tech breakthroughs off of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
octagon999 Posted September 26, 2003 Report Share Posted September 26, 2003 Question: How long will it take for humans on Earth to develop a Mk I Nuclear Jump Drive? If you can answer that, I presume you already have a great job. If not, send me a PM and we'll do lunch. We can't research the Mk I Nuclear Jump Drive yet. Our research paths are not opened yet. However, once we DO create the first Jump Drive, I can tell you about how long it will take to invent the next version. Of course, it will depend on which congressional district the Mk I was made in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T'Lariss Posted September 27, 2003 Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 QUOTE (EternusIV @ Sep 25 2003, 09:05 PM) Question: How long will it take for humans on Earth to develop a Mk I Nuclear Jump Drive? If you can answer that, I presume you already have a great job. If not, send me a PM and we'll do lunch. We can't research the Mk I Nuclear Jump Drive yet. Our research paths are not opened yet. However, once we DO create the first Jump Drive, I can tell you about how long it will take to invent the next version. Of course, it will depend on which congressional district the Mk I was made in. Interesting Comment, they have been saying that we are 20 years from a workable fusion power plant since the 70's (in fact thye are still saying 20 years) so any estimate on how long a real life research project will take is pretty much meaningless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locklyn Posted September 27, 2003 Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 I love the answer Pete came up with for this. Now, while it is still frustrating not to have the tech NOW, it is nice to see that you are in the final stages! Wait, that sounds what I used to say to our project supervisor!? Could our scientists be lying to us? Could it be that Pete has read Dilbert? Anyways, great solution! /Locklyn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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