Prospective Posted March 30, 2005 Report Share Posted March 30, 2005 Hi all, more questions about CIDS. A 6cm Gatling CIDS is rated as being "Adequate". It takes 80t of Imp Steel and 20t of Imp Electronics to build 1 unit. A MkI Plasma Pulse CIDS is also rated as being "Adequate". However, it takes 100t of Shenn stones, 300t of Improved Steel and 100t of Improved Electronics to build. The 6cm Gatling is a 20t unit whereas the MkI Plasma is a 100t unit. Since both have an Adequate rating, what advantage would you have to building a unit with equal performance but 5 times the material cost? Seems like a 6cm Gatling CIDS would be much more efficient resource wise, and performance wise they should be equal. What am I missing here? Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TErnest Posted March 30, 2005 Report Share Posted March 30, 2005 Hi all, more questions about CIDS. A 6cm Gatling CIDS is rated as being "Adequate". It takes 80t of Imp Steel and 20t of Imp Electronics to build 1 unit. A MkI Plasma Pulse CIDS is also rated as being "Adequate". However, it takes 100t of Shenn stones, 300t of Improved Steel and 100t of Improved Electronics to build. The 6cm Gatling is a 20t unit whereas the MkI Plasma is a 100t unit. Since both have an Adequate rating, what advantage would you have to building a unit with equal performance but 5 times the material cost? Seems like a 6cm Gatling CIDS would be much more efficient resource wise, and performance wise they should be equal. What am I missing here? Thanks. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The presumption is, that just as for offensive weapons, defensive weapons are "Adequate", "Good", "Poor", etc, for their MASS. Yes, a Mk I Plasma Pulse CIDS is five times the cost of a 6cm Gatling CIDS. That is because is five times as big. And does five times the work. 100 tons of "Adequate" Mk I Plasma Pulse CIDS (one of them) does as much good to a ship as 100 tons of "Adequate" 6cm Gatling CIDS (five of them.) TErnest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krelnett_of_Kraan Posted March 31, 2005 Report Share Posted March 31, 2005 The really interesting thing to compare is whether 5 6cm Gatling CIDS costs the same in terms of industrial capacity as a MkI Plasma Pulse CIDS. Some items require higher concentrations of third-tier items like electronics while others have more 1st tier items like gemstones or 2nd tier like transaluminum. In this particular case the gatling costs (5x 4780) ][23,900. The plaspulse on the other claw costs ][21,600. So if you're actively pursuing both tech trees, it's more cost-efficient (by 9.6%) to use plasma weapons for defense, at least at the 'adequate' level. Of course, either one is sufficient to obliterate the odd stray asteroid, which is the only thing that we've ever seen threaten any ships. PS: Yes, the RR economic model will still show that the plasma weapon is cheaper, but the percentage will be off. This is the true strength of the Industrial Tonnage Equivalent model. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hughestrog Posted March 31, 2005 Report Share Posted March 31, 2005 PS: Yes, the RR economic model will still show that the plasma weapon is cheaper, but the percentage will be off. This is the true strength of the Industrial Tonnage Equivalent model. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Is it? Manufacturing wise probably, but research investment wise? It'll take you far longer to develop the technology to build plasma CIDS whereas it's more striaght forward building Gatling CIDS. Another choice to be made. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobknob Posted March 31, 2005 Report Share Posted March 31, 2005 Actually I think it is the other way around. All that wasted research for the lower levels of the Gatling CIDS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krelnett_of_Kraan Posted March 31, 2005 Report Share Posted March 31, 2005 Depends on what research path you're already following. Note we said So if you're actively pursuing both tech trees, it's more cost-efficient... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ali-t-akua Posted April 1, 2005 Report Share Posted April 1, 2005 Another choice to be made. Ahh. Choices, choices. That is what this game is all about. Makes it kind of exciting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hughestrog Posted April 1, 2005 Report Share Posted April 1, 2005 Depends on what research path you're already following. Note we said So if you're actively pursuing both tech trees, it's more cost-efficient... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Fair enough point- but you may not be aware of the plasma CIDS tech tree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krelnett_of_Kraan Posted April 1, 2005 Report Share Posted April 1, 2005 Fair enough point- but you may not be aware of the plasma CIDS tech tree. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> If you're researching plasma offense, you know about plasma CIDS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cestvel Posted April 1, 2005 Report Share Posted April 1, 2005 Fair enough point- but you may not be aware of the plasma CIDS tech tree. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> If you're researching plasma offense, you know about plasma CIDS <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Only if you have researched Laser CIDS, of course, but if you gone The Gatling or Gauss Gatling way, so you typically did noit research Laser CIDS. Cestvel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobknob Posted April 1, 2005 Report Share Posted April 1, 2005 I would recommend waiting to research CIDS for a while. If you don't know some of the other paths just do some explores and chances are you will find a variety of stuff that you can ANZ and then you will know the tech path. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ali-t-akua Posted April 2, 2005 Report Share Posted April 2, 2005 I would recommend waiting to research CIDS for a while. If you don't know some of the other paths just do some explores and chances are you will find a variety of stuff that you can ANZ and then you will know the tech path. The danger with that approach is that CIDS defend against a number of weapon systems including missles, torpedoes, fighters and drones. Therefore IMO researching CIDS is one of the first defensive systems you should consider. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WKE235 Posted April 2, 2005 Report Share Posted April 2, 2005 I would recommend waiting to research CIDS for a while. If you don't know some of the other paths just do some explores and chances are you will find a variety of stuff that you can ANZ and then you will know the tech path. The danger with that approach is that CIDS defend against a number of weapon systems including missles, torpodoes, fighters and drones. Therefore IMO researching CIDS is one of the first defensive systems you should consider. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Right. As the battle I posted shows, even Fair level CIDS (like the 4cm Gatling CIDS or Laser CIDS) can do massive damage to fighters, drones, and missles ... IF you have enough of them. On the reverse, if you have NO CIDS defense and an enemy comes at you with massed fighters, you could be in deep trouble. So, toss 1 RC at something like Laser CIDS or 4 cm Gatling CIDS. You get something useful that you may need, and it's ready if needed. (Either do 4 cm Gatling CIDS with the intent to get 6cm once it opens so you get to Adequate level ... or do Laser CIDS + Light Pulse Laser to open up Pulse Laser CIDS for Adequate in that direction .. either way leads to cheap yet effective CIDS which in mass will frustrate those bullies who have spent huge amounts of SRP and research to get Superior weapons grade Fighters / Drones .. only to watch them go down in flames). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hughestrog Posted April 2, 2005 Report Share Posted April 2, 2005 I would recommend waiting to research CIDS for a while. If you don't know some of the other paths just do some explores and chances are you will find a variety of stuff that you can ANZ and then you will know the tech path. The danger with that approach is that CIDS defend against a number of weapon systems including missles, torpedoes, fighters and drones. Therefore IMO researching CIDS is one of the first defensive systems you should consider. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Exactly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locklyn Posted April 18, 2005 Report Share Posted April 18, 2005 In our defensive doctrine we've approached this rather simply. Concentrate on Armor and Shields, these protect vs everything Then CIDS, preferably from your main weapon line EDAC should be an early choice to protect from a variety of weapons And once you get into a rumble, research the specific path of defenses that the enemy employs. Locklyn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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