RTGPete Posted June 8, 2005 Report Share Posted June 8, 2005 I'm working on the new space combat reporting engine, and wanted to pass along to you what's happening. The reports will show fighters/drones starting and ending numbers, the exact effect of defensive systems, including point defense umbrella effectiveness, racial space combat bonuses, leaders, and so on. Working on a good way to clump identical ships together and still display losses in an easily readable way. There will be some engine changes as well, notably with how fighters and drones are shot down and displayed. Not talking about major changes here - the idea is to make it so that you can have an idea of how many enemy fighters/drones you'll shoot down assuming the enemy doesn't have significantly superior fighter/drone tech to reduce shootdown %, and for the attacker to be able to probe and get an idea of your point defensive umbrella coverage capabilities. Some of the more important aspects of the SNROTE naval combat system, from a designer's point of view, include Making sure that the results are reasonable but not 100% predictable Allowance for the smaller side to achieve victory through tactics, most especially through the use of warp point defense (he with the most tonnage should definitely not win every battle, or there is no point in having any combat system, but the side with both a technological and significant tonnage edge should hold a determined advantage, barring major tactical blunders) Placing significantly more emphasis on results over robotic analysis of mechanics Display pertinent information Ensure that the system does not become a predictable game of math where the imagination of a science fiction space combat is taken out of the equation and replaced with pure number crunching to predict guaranteed results Get it done within a reasonable time frame, considering the rest of the game still deserves attention with regard to upgrades or bug fixes Remembering that the vast majority of players do not actually ever fight, and are not as concerned about the specific details of the combat system, but certainly want a good battle result should they ever become involved in a combat Allowance for any number of ships, fleets and empires to be involved in a combat to provide for multi-fleet or alliance attack and defense The key points for a new report will include Fighter/Drone starting/ending numbers and armor/avoidance strength Leaders Racial space combat bonuses Ships grouped by design rather than being in a long list of one ship at a time Fleet headers with ROE's How many ships of each type were damaged or destroyed Overall tonnage on each side Point defense umbrella coverage value Exact firepower by weapon type, modified by DepLoc, Leader and racial bonus Defensive system damage mitigation values Header with battle location Fire control Strongly considering displaying All cargo on every fleet to give an idea of what the enemy is carrying around as nonmilitary cargo A chart showing all firepower by side, broken down by type (Plasma, Coherent Beam, etc) as if each side was really one big ship A chart showing all defensive system effectiveness as if each side was really one big ship Fighter/Drone technology upgrades If you ask why wasn't all this done in the first place, well, a lot of it is already in the system. Time has passed, and with plenty of player input I'm doing everything I can to meet your desires on what you want. Just takes time. If we ever design another game that emphasizes space combat as the primary goal of the game, as opposed to colonization, industrialization, exploration and combat all rolled into one as in SNROTE, then you could expect the combat system to have every bell and whistle one might imagine. That would just mean that the other systems would be less complex, as we can't design "IT" (the ultimate game that covers everything, everywhere, in 100% perfect detail) without spending an eternity at it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locklyn Posted June 8, 2005 Report Share Posted June 8, 2005 Great! The Gremloids are looking forward to the implentation of this Mk II Battle Reporting Software and the manual accompanying it! Perchance less gremloid lives be lost now with greater understanding of this primitive form of greetings that alien races perform in space under the term "Space Combat" We shall prevail. Please deliver the appropriate software code and documentation once in final version to Naval Intelligence, Oxymoron Floor, The Octagon, Genesian Home World, three stars to the left of the Riayafh Supernova and then up two stars towards the Hellenes. /Locklyn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobknob Posted June 8, 2005 Report Share Posted June 8, 2005 hmmmm.... sounds nice. Any chance of an ETA for this enhancement? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prospective Posted June 8, 2005 Report Share Posted June 8, 2005 Pete, Sounds great. While I've never been in combat, I've seen the results that have been posted here in the forums and they seem to be in need of refinement. Do you have plans to implement this change in one big chunk, or will it get phased in and updated a section at a time? Also, like Hobknob I'm intrested in getting a ROUGH ETA when this change will go into effect... Thanks for all the effort, this game rocks and I'm still enjoying it! Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ali-t-akua Posted June 8, 2005 Report Share Posted June 8, 2005 Pete, thanks for the great update. I look forward to the end result of your efforts in this regard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowKitsune Posted June 9, 2005 Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay! He chortled in his joy. -SK* *with apologies to Lewis Carroll. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ur Lord Tedric Posted June 9, 2005 Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 Thank you.... Chief Warmaster to Ur-Lord Tedric and the entire and joyful staff of the Naval Academy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clan Elder 'Keen Posted June 10, 2005 Report Share Posted June 10, 2005 "Remembering that the vast majority of players do not actually ever fight, and are not as concerned about the specific details of the combat system, but certainly want a good battle result should they ever become involved in a combat" I think for some this is because they haven't found anyone yet. For others it is because they made early friends on their first contacts, and are now hunting around for somewhere to flex their muscle. This game is certainly deep and complex, but lets be honest here- the only real excitement (other than some new fantastic high-end tech being discovered) in the turn results is battle reports. My personal belief is that more and more people will be "resorting" to violence to get full enjoyment from the game, and an improved and revamped reporting system could actually help encourage more interaction of the military variety. =) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Xaar Posted June 10, 2005 Report Share Posted June 10, 2005 I think for some this is because they haven't found anyone yet. For others it is because they made early friends on their first contacts, and are now hunting around for somewhere to flex their muscle. This game is certainly deep and complex, but lets be honest here- the only real excitement (other than some new fantastic high-end tech being discovered) in the turn results is battle reports. My personal belief is that more and more people will be "resorting" to violence to get full enjoyment from the game, and an improved and revamped reporting system could actually help encourage more interaction of the military variety. =) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yes, we suspect this is true... people "resorting" to violence. I guess there can only be so long the neighborhood stays quiet! As for exciting new tech: all the recent buzz has been about Cloaks, but Stasis Field Generators... now those are some fun stuff... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowKitsune Posted June 10, 2005 Report Share Posted June 10, 2005 Yes, we suspect this is true... people "resorting" to violence. I guess there can only be so long the neighborhood stays quiet! As for exciting new tech: all the recent buzz has been about Cloaks, but Stasis Field Generators... now those are some fun stuff... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Statis Field Generators? What do they defend against? -SK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Xaar Posted June 10, 2005 Report Share Posted June 10, 2005 The reports will show fighters/drones starting and ending numbers, the exact effect of defensive systems, including point defense umbrella effectiveness, racial space combat bonuses, leaders, and so on. Working on a good way to clump identical ships together and still display losses in an easily readable way. [*]Placing significantly more emphasis on results over robotic analysis of mechanics [*]Display pertinent information [*]Ensure that the system does not become a predictable game of math where the imagination of a science fiction space combat is taken out of the equation and replaced with pure number crunching to predict guaranteed results > [*]Racial space combat bonuses [*]Ships grouped by design rather than being in a long list of one ship at a time [*]Fleet headers with ROE's [*]How many ships of each type were damaged or destroyed [*]Overall tonnage on each side [*]Point defense umbrella coverage value [*]Exact firepower by weapon type, modified by DepLoc, Leader and racial bonus [*]Defensive system damage mitigation values [*]Header with battle location [*]Fire control Strongly considering displaying All cargo on every fleet to give an idea of what the enemy is carrying around as nonmilitary cargo A chart showing all firepower by side, broken down by type (Plasma, Coherent Beam, etc) as if each side was really one big ship A chart showing all defensive system effectiveness as if each side was really one big ship Fighter/Drone technology upgrades <{POST_SNAPBACK}> This sounds great, Pete. I am very interested to see the balance between the demands of the number crunchers and those of us that are more "impressionistic". How do you prevent pernicious number-crunching once you add racial bonus numbers? I've always viewed the "mystery" surrounding racial bonuses to be one of the great balancing effects in the game. Adding point defense results (how many fighters and drones are shot down in a battle seems like an essential feature) and more info on how a fleet operates will be very helpful -- as much as I enjoy reverse-engineering battles it will be good to have more information automatically available. -LX Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Xaar Posted June 10, 2005 Report Share Posted June 10, 2005 Yes, we suspect this is true... people "resorting" to violence. I guess there can only be so long the neighborhood stays quiet! As for exciting new tech: all the recent buzz has been about Cloaks, but Stasis Field Generators... now those are some fun stuff... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Statis Field Generators? What do they defend against? -SK <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Now, wouldn't you like to know that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowKitsune Posted June 10, 2005 Report Share Posted June 10, 2005 Yes, we suspect this is true... people "resorting" to violence. I guess there can only be so long the neighborhood stays quiet! As for exciting new tech: all the recent buzz has been about Cloaks, but Stasis Field Generators... now those are some fun stuff... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Statis Field Generators? What do they defend against? -SK <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Now, wouldn't you like to know that? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> If I didn't want to know, I wouldn't have asked the question, yes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Valwyn Posted June 14, 2005 Report Share Posted June 14, 2005 Thanks Pete! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Miles Avatar Posted June 15, 2005 Report Share Posted June 15, 2005 Stais field generators probably dont defend against anything. I bet you would have to defend yourself against them as they sound like a weapon of some kind. At least we have found a counter for Cloaks. I find that more to my liking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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