GS Session 3

[EternusIV]

I hereby second Senator-Honored One Alcorn's amended investigation proposal.

 

 

I had a more verbose version involving 'standards of review', notice and comment periods and evidentiary rules....but I think that it was probably over the top for a game and I like the simplicity and flexibility of this one.

 

I also like the concept of rotating senate members as to give each senator a shot at the committee on a rotating basis.

 

My only concern: what if the senator of the committe falls off the map or refuses to participate?

 

I don't think this will be an issue this time around - but we might want to amend it down the line for some sort of 'alternate' provision.

 

I might also add a sentence or two about what evidence might be considered...prior emails between aggrieved paries (if they exist)

 

I also think a certain burden of proof must exist at the committe level and a higher standard at the Senate level?

 

I mean - how much evidence will we normally receive other than 'he said, she said'?

 

I almost think the anti-piracy legislation is too broad. It will bring every Senator under investigation for each and every infraction involving combat. I'm not so certain the Senate envisioned such a result.

 

With all of that said - I'm sure the Senate can reserve judgment until a committee is established and both sides are heard on the matter.

 

I think its important that we enforce the ideals of the Galactic Senate. If it turns out that 'piracy' took place, we have no choice but to suggest some form of action or restitution for the aggrieved party (and realistically - that could only involve banishment from teh Senate, declaration of war upon a rogue senator or some form of restitution scheme between the empires)

 

 

 

Gary -

 

Fell free to join the Senate. It seems you are enthusiastic about Galactic Senate procedure and are becoming well-versed in our bylaws The Senate is available for all empires - regardless of political affiliation - to use as a forum to resolve disputes through diplomatic means in an open forum.

 

What of other Empires, that are either Neighbors of the two empires or allies of the two empires. They would certainly be effected by piracy, or war, or ROE settings in their area of space.

 

It took me a while to see what you were saying (my bad) I think Kurrasier was applying the doctrine of 'standing' to the bill which makes perfect sense -- we need to limit who can bring up grievances to the Senate. Arguably, neighbors might have standing - but then we'd have to define neighbors...it presents more evidentiary issues, too.

 

I think is perfectly fair to limit the grievance process to the empires directly affected (participants only)

 

REMINDER TO SENATORS - PLEASE VOTE FOR KURRASIER'S BILL IN THE GALACTIC SEESION 4 THREAD, Thanks

 

Sorry for the sloppy secretariang. Busy weekend.

[ali-t-akua]

Gary -

 

Fell free to join the Senate. It seems you are enthusiastic about Galactic Senate procedure and are becoming well-versed in our bylaws 

 

And you get to make motions like toss that pirate out of the GS.

[Hannibal]

EternusIV Posted on Jul 26 2004, 08:15 PM

My only concern: what if the senator of the committe falls off the map or refuses to participate?

 

I don't think this will be an issue this time around - but we might want to amend it down the line for some sort of 'alternate' provision.

 

I might also add a sentence or two about what evidence might be considered...prior emails between aggrieved paries (if they exist)

 

I also think a certain burden of proof must exist at the committe level and a higher standard at the Senate level?

 

I mean - how much evidence will we normally receive other than 'he said, she said'?

 

I almost think the anti-piracy legislation is too broad. It will bring every Senator under investigation for each and every infraction involving combat. I'm not so certain the Senate envisioned such a result.

 

Various comments, not necessarily in order!

 

I think Senators have the right to turn down an appointment to a committee of investigation. Personally, I'm not a big "committee" person...they are usually slang for "long delay". I'd rather pertinent facts be presented to the Senate and then the Senators vote on determination. The time span between incident and resolution will be too long "in committee", IMO. I do not disparage the idea, for it is good to investigate things. But if the incident is important to cause an investigation, it is important enough for each side to summarize their story, concerns, and evidence to the Senate in the form of a post to this board. So I guess I'm against sitting in committee because I'm against committees!

 

He said, she said is a good way of putting what a committe will get, I think. But, turn reports with dates on, email traffic, etc could be important. Who knows...

 

The anti-piracy bill is good by me...but hey, Ihelped sponsor it, and accept the "blinders" of authorship. But consider...the Senate has outlawed piracy. One happenstance of combat between empires that didn't even know each other were "in system" does not make either of the them pirates. One dot does not make a line...it takes a pattern to define behavior. If Empire A destroys/captures Empire B's ship, they have a black mark against them, but how they handle the situation will go far to convincing the Senate as to whether they are a pirate or not. If Empire A goes on to do the same to Empires B and C, they have established a pattern and the Senate will probably label them a pirate and declare open season. So, bottom line, I'll set up my engagement rules so that I am not THAT guy, carelessly gutting unknown empires on every first engagement. The Senate law is not rocket science nor able to stand up to lawyerly nitpicking...it's a broad construct for Senators to live by.

[Kurassier]

The Senate law is not rocket science nor able to stand up to lawyerly nitpicking...it's a broad construct for Senators to live by.

 

[Gary Carpenter]

Gary -

 

Fell free to join the Senate. It seems you are enthusiastic about Galactic Senate procedure and are becoming well-versed in our bylaws 

 

And you get to make motions like toss that pirate out of the GS.

I would not join any organization that would have me as a member.

 

 

Before you ask why I am in PA, I am a co-founder.

[Gary Carpenter]

Gary -

 

Fell free to join the Senate. It seems you are enthusiastic about Galactic Senate procedure and are becoming well-versed in our bylaws 

 

And you get to make motions like toss that pirate out of the GS.

I would not join any organization that would have me as a member.

 

 

Before you ask why I am in PA, I am a co-founder.

I will join if you change the name to Gary's Senate, and make me the Emperor of the GS, with at least full veto powers., then I would not be joining the Senate, the Senate would be joining me, which is acceptable.