Please prevent cheating

[WKE235]

Based on the discussion, it would seem I am the worst offender. Not only did I transfer population between races, I was preparing to transfer captured population to my home world, which is the ultimate crime. I have already put in regular orders this turn. Next turn, I will put in orders to do as much damage as possible to my positions (so anyone capturing the worlds will not benefit from my cheating) and then leave the game, to spare Pete the unpleasant duty of banning me. Once again, I would like to apologise to everyone. There is absolutely NO EXCUSE for transferring population between races.

 

My whole attitude has been wrong. I have treated this like a game. All games have some "silly" features. For example, in chess, the knight moves in a L shape but relatively few horses do that in real life :-). However, it is clear that Supernova is NOT a game. It is a simulation and the rules are there only as a general guideline. I would strongly advise everyone to think long and hard about every order that they put through. If there is any way at all that that order might be considered not 100% realistic (considering that this is, of course, a sci-fi universe), do not do it.

 

I have enjoyed playing immensely and wish I had approached the game with a better attitude so I could continue playing.

 

If it makes you feel any better, I could apply for an online theological degree. And once they process my credit card and I have the PDF degree I can print and hang on the wall, I can grant you forgiveness for your sins. Would take be alright???? I'll even buy a one of those spiffy collars to wear, just to make it all official.

[Lord Deependra]

Based on the discussion, it would seem I am the worst offender. Not only did I transfer population between races, I was preparing to transfer captured population to my home world, which is the ultimate crime. I have already put in regular orders this turn. Next turn, I will put in orders to do as much damage as possible to my positions (so anyone capturing the worlds will not benefit from my cheating) and then leave the game, to spare Pete the unpleasant duty of banning me. Once again, I would like to apologise to everyone. There is absolutely NO EXCUSE for transferring population between races.

 

My whole attitude has been wrong. I have treated this like a game. All games have some "silly" features. For example, in chess, the knight moves in a L shape but relatively few horses do that in real life :-). However, it is clear that Supernova is NOT a game. It is a simulation and the rules are there only as a general guideline. I would strongly advise everyone to think long and hard about every order that they put through. If there is any way at all that that order might be considered not 100% realistic (considering that this is, of course, a sci-fi universe), do not do it.

 

I have enjoyed playing immensely and wish I had approached the game with a better attitude so I could continue playing.

 

If it makes you feel any better, I could apply for an online theological degree. And once they process my credit card and I have the PDF degree I can print and hang on the wall, I can grant you forgiveness for your sins. Would take be alright???? I'll even buy a one of those spiffy collars to wear, just to make it all official.

 

Wow! With a collar as well :-)

 

Unfortunately, it won't really help. My positions are now compromised and worthless as everyone knows they were achieved by cheating. For example, if I were to fight another player and achieve any success, that player could rightly claim on the boards that it didn't count. And, of course the opposite applies. If the other player (who had played it straight) were to achieve success against me, he could claim that even when cheating I couldn't cut it.

[rfouasnon]

I would still accept the collar.....think of the prestige garnered in third world countries....or you could model yourself after Steve Martin in that one movie....what was it? Dirty Rotten Scoundrels? You could rename yourself Rupert , and follow in his footsteps...think of the fun and fame , this would open up new possibilities....wow!!!!

[WKE235]

I would still accept the collar.....think of the prestige garnered in third world countries....or you could model yourself after Steve Martin in that one movie....what was it? Dirty Rotten Scoundrels? You could rename yourself Rupert , and follow in his footsteps...think of the fun and fame , this would open up new possibilities....wow!!!!

 

I was thinking more along the lines of Mork from Ork when he meets Mindy. And of course I'd model my preachings on Exidor.

[cestvel]

Well can you please argue, I did. And no, I do not employ tech from other empire light years ahaed.

 

 

No but you supply it to others, you are providing advanced complexes to the Kom Ka which they dont have the tech to build, interesting how that doesn't count as cheating?

A world with a kom ka population is able to build worldlab installations and continue to use them when your gone.

 

Also I guess any divisions you build at the Kom Ka homeworld you wont load up and use against me as it wouldnt be right for those divisions to take on your advanced tech right? They should operate and act as Kom ka as it uses there population.....

 

You dont like something as it worked against you, but if you do things that others consider cheating that doesnt count.

 

The game isnt perfect but if tech is able to be swapped for space ships and colonies the same should hold true for ground tech or every ground pounder has wasted their time as the tech they develop doesnt appear as a item you can touch and feel in the game.

 

 

Well you mix things up again. The installations I build on the KomKa would work even better if I kept the world.

Not getting better when I give the world back to the KomKa, so waht difference is it, if I use the AIC or the KomKa?

 

I can only do one thing at the KomKa HW, either I build troops or I build installations, make up your mind.

 

Well I wanted to know from Pete *if* division transfers it is a bug or not. The way you employ it was unexpected

and borders on cheating in my book, as you could normally not bring in troops from your other empire or build it on your HW by them, because there is only one TC in that popgroup. But if it is ok by Pete one have to live with it.

 

And to employ space components, you still have to be able to build the ship yourself. You cannot simply transfer a whole ship. That the ship does not get better by trading should be clear as well.

 

And that some races have other (or better) tech than others is clearly within the rules from the start.

Also that this can be traded.

 

That you can transfer divisions was something new to me, as it was *not* possible as I started playing Supernova !

 

You may keep oblivious to these arguments as ususal.

[Paradigm]

I'll preface by saying that The Paradigm has never sent or received a division to/from another empire, but in my opinion it is so easy to work around a division transfer block as to make it not worth the effort and inconvenience. The amount of population and production required to assemble divisions is so modest that if division transfers were prohibited, players would just transfer the materials instead and have the same basic net effect. And while there are some unusual situations where such a change would affect game play, they are very minimal and easily worked around. I view it all as a simplification to make an already complex game a little less labor intensive. Perhaps all the war machines are robotic and only require someone to push buttons.

 

I also have the feeling that a race that invests heavily in lifeform design and research for ground combat is going to be at a net disadvantage to the majority that focus on space combat abilities, so I find it a little hard to begrudge them being able to receive divisions from other empires in exchange for their services.

 

Now what I'm not too keen on are players moving the entire population of conquered home worlds to their own. I'm not sure what the solution to that should be, but it seems unbalancing, especially when it was being done with gates and not even requiring the construction of ships capable of moving that much population. But that is a different discussion for a different thread.

[cestvel]

I'll preface by saying that The Paradigm has never sent or received a division to/from another empire, but in my opinion it is so easy to work around a division transfer block as to make it not worth the effort and inconvenience. The amount of population and production required to assemble divisions is so modest that if division transfers were prohibited, players would just transfer the materials instead and have the same basic net effect. And while there are some unusual situations where such a change would affect game play, they are very minimal and easily worked around. I view it all as a simplification to make an already complex game a little less labor intensive. Perhaps all the war machines are robotic and only require someone to push buttons.

 

I also have the feeling that a race that invests heavily in lifeform design and research for ground combat is going to be at a net disadvantage to the majority that focus on space combat abilities, so I find it a little hard to begrudge them being able to receive divisions from other empires in exchange for their services.

 

Now what I'm not too keen on are players moving the entire population of conquered home worlds to their own. I'm not sure what the solution to that should be, but it seems unbalancing, especially when it was being done with gates and not even requiring the construction of ships capable of moving that much population. But that is a different discussion for a different thread.

 

Since Gates got restricted, I know of some who used simple transports with 2000 AP and 1000 Col Berth to accomplish the same task.

 

The problem is not moving the pop, but transfering it. Having another popgroup on ones HW with the pop transfered in from another HW would be ok in my book. These new "slave-workers" would be subject to attriction of course.

 

But your argument of just transfering tech and industry and resources over has some merit. One would maybe loose a bit of industrial capacity, but the effect would be nearly the same as a simply transfer.

 

The whole pop stuff should be fixed or we have to live with it. And as I understood Pete now, he does not like it, how it is, but there is no way to fix it and correct the things done in the past, so we have to live with it.

 

End of story.

[hobknob]

Pop is the single limiting resource in the game and if you own it you should be able to do with it what you want including moving it all back to your HW if that is what you want. How you get it there is not too important.

 

With the gate tax being prohibitively high the best alternative is to move it with fleets.

 

Where is the problem?

 

Making a straight transfer of troops from one empire to another should be banned IMHO, but there are plenty of ways that aren't straightforward that would still work fine. The biggest problem most face is the nasty surprise when the defenders have grown a backbone by changing lifeform types. It makes those tough 12+ Def rated lifeforms worth something after all.

 

In the end, however, it just takes a bit more time to capture the world. I have heard of few worlds that actually staved off capture once into the ground combat phase and only a single world that was ever reclaimed.

[Paradigm]

Pop is the single limiting resource in the game and if you own it you should be able to do with it what you want including moving it all back to your HW if that is what you want. How you get it there is not too important.

 

With the gate tax being prohibitively high the best alternative is to move it with fleets.

 

Where is the problem?

 

Making a straight transfer of troops from one empire to another should be banned IMHO, but there are plenty of ways that aren't straightforward that would still work fine. The biggest problem most face is the nasty surprise when the defenders have grown a backbone by changing lifeform types. It makes those tough 12+ Def rated lifeforms worth something after all.

 

In the end, however, it just takes a bit more time to capture the world. I have heard of few worlds that actually staved off capture once into the ground combat phase and only a single world that was ever reclaimed.

 

That makes me wonder what is the point in reclaiming worlds if all the pop has been stripped from them and shipped off to parts unknown?

[hobknob]

After a certain point in your technology there is little point in trying to reclaim worlds. However, don't forget that you only get LC's on your HW so it might be a good idea to retake your HW even if it is a bit shy on pop for that reason alone.

 

You can always repopulate it with your own captured pop too.

[Coconutheads]

Pop is the single limiting resource in the game and if you own it you should be able to do with it what you want including moving it all back to your HW if that is what you want. How you get it there is not too important.

 

With the gate tax being prohibitively high the best alternative is to move it with fleets.

 

Where is the problem?

 

Making a straight transfer of troops from one empire to another should be banned IMHO, but there are plenty of ways that aren't straightforward that would still work fine. The biggest problem most face is the nasty surprise when the defenders have grown a backbone by changing lifeform types. It makes those tough 12+ Def rated lifeforms worth something after all.

 

In the end, however, it just takes a bit more time to capture the world. I have heard of few worlds that actually staved off capture once into the ground combat phase and only a single world that was ever reclaimed.

 

That makes me wonder what is the point in reclaiming worlds if all the pop has been stripped from them and shipped off to parts unknown?

 

Paradigm,

 

I have wondered why someone would wish to reclaim a captured HW myself, particularly one that has been relieved of it's burdensome population. We performed this 'transferrance' at Evremond 9 when we took it from The Black Cloud. Yet for some reason, White Shadow Imperium decided he wished to recover that world (perhaps for his buddy?) which had perhaps 158 to 168 pops onboard.

 

So you should try posing that question to him. He's been known to post here every so often and perhaps he'd provide you with an answer.

[Paradigm]

Paradigm,

 

I have wondered why someone would wish to reclaim a captured HW myself, particularly one that has been relieved of it's burdensome population. We performed this 'transferrance' at Evremond 9 when we took it from The Black Cloud. Yet for some reason, White Shadow Imperium decided he wished to recover that world (perhaps for his buddy?) which had perhaps 158 to 168 pops onboard.

 

Just one of those crazy traditions in gameing. Someone takes your planet/homeworld/country/sword/doughnut/gold/etc. from you and you counter attack to take it back. It kind of kills the fun if the item teleports away the first time it is taken.

[Gary Carpenter]

Well I was bitten by the bug from the original posting in this thread, IE during transfer of ships between fleets all the fuel disappeared. I sent an email to Pete to get the fuel back, but as usual no response.

 

So I will complain here, and see if PETE is reading the board, since he is NOT reading the three now EMAILS I sent him.

 

Three emails? Gee, I always get a polite response after one email. Perhaps it's your breath?

 

 

Good to know the GM plays favorites.

[Gary Carpenter]

Based on the discussion, it would seem I am the worst offender. Not only did I transfer population between races, I was preparing to transfer captured population to my home world, which is the ultimate crime. I have already put in regular orders this turn. Next turn, I will put in orders to do as much damage as possible to my positions (so anyone capturing the worlds will not benefit from my cheating) and then leave the game, to spare Pete the unpleasant duty of banning me. Once again, I would like to apologise to everyone. There is absolutely NO EXCUSE for transferring population between races.

 

My whole attitude has been wrong. I have treated this like a game. All games have some "silly" features. For example, in chess, the knight moves in a L shape but relatively few horses do that in real life :-). However, it is clear that Supernova is NOT a game. It is a simulation and the rules are there only as a general guideline. I would strongly advise everyone to think long and hard about every order that they put through. If there is any way at all that that order might be considered not 100% realistic (considering that this is, of course, a sci-fi universe), do not do it.

 

I have enjoyed playing immensely and wish I had approached the game with a better attitude so I could continue playing.

 

 

I can see no reason why captured pop can not come live on the original HW or vis versa. Look at every space movie out there, Star trek, humans living with andorians, vulcans, Ect. And I can see no reason why the Human army should not protect a Federation outpost maned by friendly delicate soap bubble race.

[Dr. Pierre Chang]

"I can see no reason why captured pop can not come live on the original HW or vis versa. Look at every space movie out there, Star trek, humans living with andorians, vulcans, Ect. And I can see no reason why the Human army should not protect a Federation outpost maned by friendly delicate soap bubble race. "

 

I agree. Just build the troops either on the planet, or move them out legally and garrison the planet. DON'T put a TC-only pop group on your ally's planet, and have him TR over his brain in a jar troops and have them instantly morph into Gorn. That is my ONLY heartburn.